Garage ruined engine when car took in for MOT

mark5

sartois wrote: »

Ok so the garage has come back with the final bill and what is their final offer. They are not claiming on their insurance and have come up with a 50/50 split of the costs.

So the garage have:
1. Replaced the glow plugs (£800).
2. Replaced the injectors (£200).
3. Carried out oil service
4. Changed the oil filter.
5. Carried out the MOT.
6. With parts and labour the total bill before VAT is £1500.

So the owner (against the advice of his site manager who says she should pay in full) has offered to go with 50/50 on this bill, charging £750 + VAT as his final offer on this.

My friend is not willing to budge on this and thinks the garage should pay more.

The problem I can't get past is that the garage did the emissions test when the oil light was on and have provided mixed statements about whether or not they tested the oil before hand. The damage to the engine (which is the bulk of the cost of repair) was caused when the emissions test was done, not while she was on the way to the garage less than a mile from her house.

Since neither party is willing to budge on their position her next option I believe is to 'pay under protest' and write that on the receipt when she collects her car, which would leave her the option to take it to court later on if she wishes to do so.

So based on the above.... does she actually have a case to take to court?

The DPF is probably going to need attention soon, this isn't the garage's fault either btw!

Retrogamer

sartois wrote: »

I did write down exactly what he quoted, but possible he got them the wrong way around?

£1500 is the total cost, for the parts, labour, service and MOT (plus VAT on top). He said the engine is now perfectly fine and did say the work carried out and parts would be guaranteed for a year.

The garage have replaced a couple of things on the engine which "may" get a little more life out of it, but tbh that engine will still fail at some point sooner, rather than later i imagine.
You could get another, used second hand engine bought and installed for less than £1.5k

Chrysalis

I am no mechanic but looks like no engine swap has been carried out and instead minimal work has been done to get it roadworthy, which has me agreeing with others about selling the car quick as possible.

The 50/50 offer does indicate the owner is not 100% confident its all the driver's fault. Would I contest it? no idea to be honest. My decision would be based on how much I could sell the car for, and what a replacement car would cost, so the £750 would be factored into that.

m_c

Going by the bits changed, the engine has run on oil. To do that level of damage to injectors and glowplugs will most likely mean the top of the pistons have melted as well.

I've not read the full thread, but you can only hold the garage liable if their negligence caused the problem, which given the damage, I'd very much doubt.
My guess is excess oil has built up in the intercooler/charge air hoses, (could of come from turbo seals, or from the breather - without the cause being rectified, the problem could happen again), where during gentle driving it will quite happily sit doing no harm. The garage has then revved the engine harder than it has been getting revved during normal use, which has caused the oil to be blown up into the engine, resulting in a runaway. It doesn't take much oil to cause a diesel to runaway, you've just got to get the oil in the cylinder, and the four strokes will take care of the rest, until oxygen or fuel is removed, or something goes bang.

Chrysalis

m_c isnt a garage running the test without fixing the oil first negligent tho?

m_c

Chrysalis wrote: »

m_c isnt a garage running the test without fixing the oil first negligent tho?

Only if it could be reasonably foreseen.
You are talking about an uncommon fault that in simple terms would need a perfect storm to result in what happened here, so you would have a hard job proving negligence.


As long as the garage checked the oil level, and the engine sounded fine prior to the test (only real check you can do where a timing chain is involved), they would have no reason to foresee an engine failure.
A low oil level could of been a symptom of the fault, but you would assume it was just normal oil usage. To give some context, diesel injection quantity at idle is typically measured in fractions of microliters/grams per power stroke. Throw in a couple millilitres per stroke of airborne oil into the stroke, and you get one mighty smoky bang, with the only limit being how much oxygen is there to make the bang.

Retrogamer

The garage performing the MOT emissions check, whilst the engine oil light is on and without checking the service history with the owner is definitely negligent.

Chrysalis

m_c wrote: »

Only if it could be reasonably foreseen.
You are talking about an uncommon fault that in simple terms would need a perfect storm to result in what happened here, so you would have a hard job proving negligence.


As long as the garage checked the oil level, and the engine sounded fine prior to the test (only real check you can do where a timing chain is involved), they would have no reason to foresee an engine failure.

oil light was on.

If I owned a diesel car and took it to the garage with a lit oil light, I would expect them to not do the test until fixing the oil, I think thats a reasonable expectation as they are professionals.

Of course before I read this thread I never heard of diesel runaway which is the problem with the mechanic sector, they can get away with a lot due to people's lack of knowledge in engines.

Are you trying to say that because a oil issue doesnt always result in a blown engine its ok to ignore it and proceed with a MOT test?

benten69

Chrysalis wrote: »

Of course before I read this thread I never heard of diesel runaway which is the problem with the mechanic sector, they can get away with a lot due to people's lack of knowledge in engines.

That has nothing to do with the mechanic sector and 100% everything to do with people not wanting to educate themselves. I am not a mechanic by trade, but I am well aware of all the possible issues that can occur and I know enough so that if a mechanic is trying to pull the wool over my eyes (as one tried to do just a few months ago) I can put them in their place.

If something does happen that I don't know about, google is in everyones pockets these days, but no-one seems to bother using it to learn for themselves and think the grease monkeys in the garage are "experts" when the reality is that 95% of the time they are FAR from being experts in anything.

You could plaster your comment about anything. How many people know how an iPhone works? Or how their digital camera works, or their treadmill or their electric drill? These are all easy things to learn, but people don't want to learn. Then they complain that "xxx sector can get away with anything due to peoples lack of knowledge".

All the knowledge you need is available on the internet, you don't even need to pay for a fancy education these days to learn 99.9% of things. If people want to know, they will source the info, if they don't they will remain ignorant and blame that companies prey on them because they don't understand.

Sorry, rant over, but that really does bug me when people blame others for their lack of knowledge.

bob_a_builder

Driving it on the extra thin oil mixed with diesel will have accelerated cylinder wear too, so I'd definitely get rid quick before it blows up again

Pity the poor sod who buys this car next !