IAS Appeal

mjc126

Hi – I had pretty much decided on not bothering with an IAS appeal, reading up the advice about their kangaroo courts, but thought I would just check as I have until Wednesday if I do appeal. If anyone was about to ready - could I have your thoughts please.

I have received an APNR PCN notice to the registered keeper from Topher for an overstay at a Homebase car park in Bath. Whilst I'm the registered keeper I don't drive the car. The event happened on the 13 February 17 and the invoice says date of posting 2 March 17 and I received this on the 6 March. Am I right in thinking I should have received this by 28 February?

Topher have rejected my appeal to them that there is no keeper liability as they have not
followed the timescale provisions inSchedule 4 of POFA 2012. I have also told them that I don't know who the driver was on the day.


The invoice makes no comment about the keeper liability and neither do the signs at the car park – I’ve managed to get a photo of a sign, which is on the link. Whilst the sign says BPA on it I think they are only IPC members.

Thank you in advance.
https://www. dropbox.com/s/0in54syf2xuyisu/Topher%20sign.jpeg?dl=0

Guys_Dad

I agree with the out of time point, but you must include the relevant paragraphs from POFA to support your case. Your appeal to IAS should confirm that there is more than 1 driver of the car, it being a family car.

That you were definitely NOT the driver at the time and that the law of the land has a presumption of innocence. Should they not accept that, then their chicanery and blatant refusal to uphold the law will be exposed in any forthcoming court case showing why it is a kangaroo appeal service being run.

Umkomaas

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0in54syf2xuyisu/Topher%20sign.jpeg?dl=0

Whilst I'm the registered keeper I don't drive the car.

If you can prove you were elsewhere that day you might have a chance of winning at the IAS. But you will need irrefutable evidence as ordinarily everything stated by the motorist is disbelieved, anything stated by the PPC is accepted. Reverse (perverse) justice!

The event happened on the 13 February 17 and the invoice says date of posting 2 March 17 and I received this on the 6 March. Am I right in thinking I should have received this by 28 February?

If it was a windscreen ticket you need to be in receipt (served) of the NtK between days 29 to 56 after the date of parking event (day 0)

If it was an ANPR capture the NtK must be served within 14 days of the date of the parking event (day 0).

The invoice makes no comment about the keeper liability and neither do the signs at the car park – I’ve managed to get a photo of a sign, which is on the link. Whilst the sign says BPA on it I think they are only IPC members.

They can 'belong' to both organisations. But it's the organisation logo contained within the roundel that is the important one in terms of issuing and pursuing the ticket and by whom any second stage appeal will be heard:

IPC roundel - the IAS
BPA roundel - POPLA

The_Deep

If you can prove you were elsewhere that day you might have a chance of winning at the IAS. But you will need irrefutable evidence

You do not have to prove anything, it is up to the PPC to prove that you were the driver. If/when the IAS adjudicator says you have no proof you can use this against them in court. Tell the judge that the anonymous adjudicator has overturned all normal rules of evidence and has fialed to identify himself.

A loss at IAS is to be expected, but the it can be another arrow in your bow.

yotmon

The_Deep wrote: »

If you can prove you were elsewhere that day you might have a chance of winning at the IAS. But you will need irrefutable evidence

You do not have to prove anything, it is up to the PPC to prove that you were the driver. If/when the IAS adjudicator says you have no proof you can use this against them in court, by saying that the adjudicator has misdirected himself. A loss at IAS is the norm, but costs the PPC money.

Yes, but I think that this was a way of 'heading them off at the pass' - at the appeal stage, rather than as a defence for court.

mjc126

Thank you everyone. As always, you have been most helpful.


I have a credit card receipt to prove I was 110 miles away 20 minutes after the car left the car park.


I might as well do the IAS appeal - as you say, it might just bring it all to a close.

Umkomaas

mjc126 wrote: »

Thank you everyone. As always, you have been most helpful.


I have a credit card receipt to prove I was 110 miles away 20 minutes after the car left the car park.


I might as well do the IAS appeal - as you say, it might just bring it all to a close.

Were you on work business? Can you get a confirmatory letter from your employer? Or any other form of corroborating evidence.

The IAS is quite likely to say that your card might have been used by anyone you had provided the PIN number to (and especially if it is a jointly held account).

You have to pile in with every conceivable piece of evidence available so you can nail them to the floorboards. Even then, you won't necessarily get an acceptance of your appeal; what we have seen previously is what appears to have been a quiet word placed in the ear of the PPC by the IAS to tell them to cancel the charge to avoid the IAS judging against them.

Half_way

mjc126 wrote: »

Thank you everyone. As always, you have been most helpful.


I have a credit card receipt to prove I was 110 miles away 20 minutes after the car left the car park.


I might as well do the IAS appeal - as you say, it might just bring it all to a close.

Do you own a smartphone, i believe that Samsung and other android devices will let you see your location history via google maps, you need to go to google maps, and log in with the same username/password you use on your phone then select timeline/his toy and it should show if you click raw data

mjc126

It's a post office receipt for posting out company post. I can get a letter from my company stating I was at my desk that day and took the post.
Whilst the card is for a joint account, our cards have different last digits. Like the majority - I don't give out my PIN number - although it doesn't sound as if IAS is likely to believe that.
Thank you for the additional advice.

mjc126

Thank you. I never knew that was possible. I don't always have my location on, but I'll see if I can find some data.

Half_way

mjc126 wrote: »

Thank you. I never knew that was possible. I don't always have my location on, but I'll see if I can find some data.

From what i understand even if you have location turned off, it may still keep a track via what phone mast transmitters you were near., although be it not that accurate, if you were a substantial distance away it should show
Some people find it a little creepy, however since owning a smart phone i've found it to be incredibly useful.