Taxi Driver, Universal Credit, Self Employed nightmare!

Emwalsh

My Fiance and I now live together since November 2016 with my 2 children 6 and 12. We went through the mind field that was the application process and between us not knowing what we were doing, the job centre staff not having a clue and so making many errors (I am aware we were in a trial period so they are learning) and us not being given the relevant if any information (a pack?) we got through it. My question is about my Fiances self employed expenses as taxi driver:

He works 60 hours a week
He hires his car so does not pay for MOT etc as this is included in his hire price and everything else that comes with it.
He pays into a pension which is also deducted after expenses.
He pays tax once a year which brings his income for the month to roughly 100 quid for one month (that month you get more and evens out over the year so they say as we were worried about the gainful employment issue that month)

They ask us every month what his mileage is and he says he pays for e.g £400 for fuel and has receipts. They then asked what is the mileage and he says I don't do it that way as it would look like he doesn't make an income any month which he clearly does and from the beginning was not asked to do this (he has started now doing it but we need more information until we try this way at the end of this month.

So can someone explain why they keep asking and explain how it works and also what would happen if it looked like he was not in gainful employment even though he is.

The most recent guy on the phone sounded shocked he paid £500 in fuel this month.....he is a taxi driver!! his job entails driving around constantly unless waiting for jobs and even then he will go looking for the work into different areas. We are decent people that want to do it right but I feel like if we do as they ask we will be the ones to suffer the consequences and the people on the phones can not give us a straight answer or explain it in a way that makes it clear.

I think one month it looked like his expense for fuel on rough mileage by there calculation was £2000 lol which is ridiculous!

Help!!

Thank you (P.S) I do not work since November due to childcare let down and am now looking for part time actively although I am on "light touch" group at the job centre and so they don't care if I look for work or not.....eh! was it not the point of moving away from tax credits to stop people not working when they can if even a little

Mersey_2

Sadly, errors with UC are still commonplace (over a year after it was new to JCP and other DWP staff).


Yes, he should have been provided with a pack: UC5 - guide to self-employment for UC claimants.


He's obliged to report earnings and expenses etc each month over the 'phone.


Most of the UC national contact centre staff work from a script, so he may need to request a supervisor and also ask them to open a complaint.


Specifically re taxi drivers: most local authorities have a separate box to tick for them as they realise business expenses will be different. However, UC does not so this is probably why he's coming up against staff unaware of the differences.

Emwalsh

Hi and thank you for your reply.

The errors were not just slight on there part but resulted in a complete reclaim. We were prepared for this thankfully due to much research into the process of application.

He phones in every month and will always do so but something just doesn't sit right.

I will try to obtain that pack it should be online and I think go as far as to write a letter to management just to cover us for the future. I assume by doing it monthly there is no end of year over payment worry although I also don't think this could be true. Its so all over the place but we are doing as they say.

They happily accepted his fuel receipts in the first, second and third months although asking the mileage question so hopefully there can be no penalty if when we enquire it shows actually they needed the mileage.

I will ask him to call and speak to a supervisor re complaint.

Thank you

Icequeen99

It sounds like they are thinking about the flat rate scheme for permitted expenses - which is similar to the rules for tax.

Is he a black cab driver or a mini cab driver?

Does he deduct the hire cost for the car when working out his UC?

In terms of gainful self-employment - he is gainfully self-employed he shouldn't be found not to be gainfully self-employed but what might happen if they use mileage is that the Minimum Income Floor might kick in which would treat him as earning 35 x National Minimum wage each week even if he is earning less than that.

IQ

Mersey_2

Emwalsh wrote: »

Hi and thank you for your reply.

I will try to obtain that pack

I will ask him to call and speak to a supervisor re complaint.

Thank you

This will help a lot. Plus the DWP staff are meant to use a page of this UC5 to ask the Qs when he calls each month, so you'll know if the person hasn't if they ask different questions. If they do, request to speak to a supervisor and report the info on that page (essentially income, exp, pension contribs etc - its a set form)

paddedjohn

He earns £100 a month?? No wonder they are questioning his mileage.

Caz3121

skcollobcat10 wrote: »

That's £2.60 per hour for 60 hours per week earning £100 per month over the course of the year.

£2.60 per hour x 60 hours would be £156 in a week
if earning £100 per month then he is earning under less than 40p per hour...something wrong here

Ames

I think they mean that in the month that the tax payment for the year is due, the earnings after that tax bill is £100, for the other eleven months it's a normal wage.

bspm

Caz3121 wrote: »

£2.60 per hour x 60 hours would be £156 in a week
if earning £100 per month then he is earning under less than 40p per hour...something wrong here

The post stated

He works 60 hours a week
He hires his car so does not pay for MOT etc as this is included in his hire price and everything else that comes with it.
He pays into a pension which is also deducted after expenses.
He pays tax once a year which brings his income for the month to roughly 100 quid for one month (that month you get more and evens out over the year so they say as we were worried about the gainful employment issue that month)

jadex

Ames wrote: »

I think they mean that in the month that the tax payment for the year is due, the earnings after that tax bill is £100, for the other eleven months it's a normal wage.

one can always put aside cca 20% (30% to cover NI but then there is £11k tax free allowance) and do not treat it as a wage -> keep it in dedicated account (but then it is treated as available capital, so no ideal if on benefits) or pay more often than once a year to HMRC coffers (when being close to £6k threshold)

theartfullodger

Emwalsh wrote: »

.....etc etc etc..
He works 60 hours a week.....

He pays tax once a year which brings his income for the month to roughly 100 quid for one month ....etc etc..etc................/

I smell a large rodent: He can't be surviving on £100 a month: What other income does he have (from wherever, declared or not..)

On the basis of what you state (that his income per month is about £100) he would OBVIOUSLY be better off on JSA (if over 25 then £73:10/week, = £316:77/month) or, better, stacking shelves at Tescos..

This story does not sound correct: Please tell us what is really going on?