UKCPS, course of action

kevinbooth83

Fruitcake wrote: »

They can refuse to sign for it and thus have proof that it was never received.

Ok that makes sense, thanks for clarifying, so long as i've got proof of postage the onus would be on them to prove they haven't received it, which they could do if they refused to sign for it.

Right I think i'm set, thanks for the replies everybody, I know the info is in the sticky, but i do feel more confident having spoken to active members about it, thanks again.

Coupon-mad

Please don't appeal a windscreen ticket late.

Wait for the NTK then appeal - AFAIK you haven't had the postal NTK yet? The advice in the NEWBIES thread about IPC tickets is now to wait for the NTK anyway. I changed it maybe 10 days ago, at the last edit.

kevinbooth83

Redx wrote: »

oh yes they can , they can refuse it , all you have proven after that is its failure to arrive

it is also one of many reasons that these companies use a P O BOX number, as a P O Box number cannot "sign" for packages , not signed for means undelivered

this topic has been discussed hundreds of times , its deemed in law to have "arrived" 2 days after proof of posting by standard first class post by Royal Mail, hence why none of the paperwork you have received (or receive in the future) is "signed for", they only have to prove it was sent in the post by getting the same proof of posting from R.M.

I accept you dont understand these legalities, but not understanding them does not negate them

you have asked for advice from people who know the topic, best that you accept that advice and dont try to be "clever" by doing something different

and DO NOT ALTER THE TEMPLATE , as you are likely to give away who the driver was by describing the circumstances on the day , save that for another day, like in a defence due to receiving an MCOL

Apologies if I came accross as unappreciative of the advice, i didn't see it stated so just thought it wouldn't matter how it was posted, i stand corrected now and genuinely appreciate the advice.

As for the edit, I added only the below sentence, I can delete it before I print it -

"I also enclose evidence that the driver had in fact purchased a valid parking ticket on the day in question, attached you will find photos of both the PCN and the pay & display ticket, which you will see both carry the same date and the ticket fee covers parking for the time in which the PCN was issued."

Redx

due to what was said above, and because its late for a windscreen ticket appeal, do as CM says and wait for the keeper to get a postal NTK

also bear in mind that some judges take the view that these tickets should be printed on both sides and suitably sticky so they dont "fall down or blow away" , in other words they are not fir for purpose

the postal issue has been "stated " hundreds if not thousands of times on this forum in the time I have been here , so about 4 to 5 years at the very least

it is considered "normal" for legal cases and has been for decades due to the royal mail having the royal charter to deliver everything you can prove you contracted them for

let us assume that you send it special delivery or "signed for" and it isnt signed for , then its held at the local PO sorting office and eventually returned to sender

so you have no proof of delivery - ergo you dont use either of those 2 methods

kevinbooth83

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Please don't appeal a windscreen ticket late.

Wait for the NTK then appeal - AFAIK you haven't had the postal NTK yet? The advice in the NEWBIES thread about IPC tickets is now to wait for the NTK anyway. I changed it maybe 10 days ago, at the last edit.

No nothing has come through the post yet, the PPC does state 21 days which is a day overdue and prompting me to act tomorrow.

I did read in the sticky to wait a month but the initial replies to my post seemed like 'newer' advice, but if it was only edited recently then I know now why I was confused.

Redx

the NTK cannot arrive before day 28 , so has to arrive between day 29 and day 56 if they wish to invoke POFA2012

hence why she has said "wait for the NTK"

most of the regulars here would state the "old way" , especially because you brought it up tonight

now I know the advice has changed to "wait for the NTK" then that is the way forward

by the way , it is not prompting YOU , it is prompting THE KEEPER to appeal as keeper having been handed the ticket by the DRIVER

the words "me , myself and I" are banned on this forum , replaced by THE KEEPER , THE DRIVER etc

or do you think that people like UKCPS dont bother to read forums like this one ?

or take screenshots ?

EXCEL/VCS tried it with lamilad

kevinbooth83

Ok i'm with you, the keeper shall wait until the NTK arrives, then post their appeal, the unaltered template letter, by standard 1st with proof of posting.

Coupon-mad

kevinbooth83 wrote: »

No nothing has come through the post yet, the PPC does state 21 days which is a day overdue and prompting me to act tomorrow.

I did read in the sticky to wait a month but the initial replies to my post seemed like 'newer' advice, but if it was only edited recently then I know now why I was confused.

Even if I hadn't updated the sticky, I would always say that posting an appeal a day late, particularly on a Friday, is far too late to try an appeal. I would have advised to wait for the second appeal window, even if you'd asked me a year ago, because you missed the self-imposed 21 day limit.

Also, in addition to the others pointing out that you never send stuff to any PPC for them to sign for (or not!). Sending anything for a fiver, on a Friday, that requires a scummy firm to sign for it at the weekend is asking for the letter to sit in the local sorting office for a week. Even a non-PPC firm that doesn't work on Saturdays would NOT get that letter until much later, they'd get a note from the sorting office asking them to go & collect it...

Redx

correct (unless they have an alternative appeal method , so read the NTK after arrival)

and as its an IPC member it will be rejected, which the blurb in the NEWBIES thread tells you (I have just re-read it to be sure of what it now says)

so its all a paper exercise , for now

kevinbooth83

Ok, will follow instruction once the NTK arrives then go on from there, I appreciate you all taking the time to give the advice and also apologies for taking up your time dispensing it, I gather this happens a lot with newbies, so thank you