Investment Trusts

Stirfry

I chose Murray for income and bought funds in my ISA around 18 months ago. I then bought further funds held outside my ISA back in Oct 17. I have since sold funds held in ISA and just about broke even with dividends included. But funds bought in Oct 17 showing a 13% loss. I have been unhappy with Murray for some time and realise it is my first major newbie mistake, but have been reluctant to sell and consolidate my losses. You mention Witan and F & C but I have been considering Bankers as an alternative. Still unsure when to cut my losses.

pafpcg

talexuser wrote: »

..... but I don't see Murray as a capital preservation fund and the last 5 years have been absolutely dismal compared to Witan or Foreign & Colonial.

That's because Murray International is classified as a "Global Equity Income" investment trust - its main aim is to generate income, with a dividend yield of 4.6% currently. Witan and F&C are both aimed at growth with dividend yields of only 2.0% and 1.4% respectively.

Take a look at the AIC web-site (www.theaic.co.uk) for descriptions of the various IT categories and the statistics for each trust to allow comparison.

PS: In my opinion, the effect on IT share prices due to natural growth (the profitability of the enterprises in which ITs have invested) has been overwhelmed by fluctuations in the sterling exchange rate since June 2016.

talexuser

I also have Bankers, but again it's not particularly for preservation. I have moved somewhat into Ruffer, Capital Gearing, Personal Assets, RIT, Troy etc because overall done well and think this run can't go on for ever, and have plenty in income, growth and trackers, can withstand a big downturn and just want to mitigate a little.

I don't need income now so look at total return and sector allocation more than category allocation.

It's always tempting to think you should get back to where you were before selling therefore no loss but that is a mistake. You cannot be sure of a profit on everything, so if it doesn't work out and you are unhappy after giving enough time to make sure it's down to the manager and not the sector or other external reasons, get out and move on. That's not a reason to swap and change every couple of months though!

p.s Bankers is a lower yield too.

Thrugelmir

Stirfry wrote: »

I chose Murray for income and bought funds in my ISA around 18 months ago. I then bought further funds held outside my ISA back in Oct 17. I have since sold funds held in ISA and just about broke even with dividends included.

Investing is a long term game, ideally 10 years plus. Portfolio's should be viewed as a whole. As different elements will perform asymmetrically. Objective being to make a gain overall every year. Chasing fads means more often or not you'll arrive late at the party.

ColdIron

I've had MYI for about 3 years and it's done exactly what I bought it for, an above average yield of 4.5% - 5.5% with growing dividend which I use as income. Its charges are low and it provides some cover to Latin America/EM, including Fixed Income, that I don't have elsewhere. I'd be less impressed as a growth investor but then I wouldn't have bought it for that as it's not a growth (or WP) fund. Who knows what the future holds so I'll worry about the absolute share price when I need to sell it, hopefully not for some time to come

takesyourchances

cloud_dog wrote: »

Wow :eek:

So, you are big on income funds then.

I suppose it could be argued that the portfolio 'as is' is acceptable but possibly depending on your age, commitments, financial situation, yada ,yada...

Really unsure why you need soooo many income funds.

EDIT: On a slight tangent, I would consider FCPT as part of a property asset (as it actually holds bricks and mortar).

Yes this IT / Income portfolio section I have has become "big" on income funds. I have put a lot of effort into researching and looking into the IT's and hopefully it'll be acceptable for what it is and it's objectives.

It is not my only stock investments, I also hold VLS as a core with satellite funds for Global Small Caps, EM, Asia and Asian Small Caps as a portfolio.

With regards to the IT's, age and things, I am as good as 39 now, so hopefully plenty of years ahead, I am re-investing dividend yields into the IT's to compound and create more dividends and repeat the process.


I am playing a mental game with myself to keep motivated and set myself a goal for the dividend income from the IT's to cover my basic living expenses "if required", but I would continue to re-invest and add fresh money in until the time I was ready to use the yield and I am also adding to my other portfolio of investments. I can see the dividend amounts increasing which is encouraging / and re-investing increasing more so feel I can reach this goal set.

I have a cash buffer, no debt and no mortgage on my UK property and 3 overseas properties owned outright and they cover themselves with running costs, I started into these when I was 25 and I have no dependants.

Some stage into 40's I may want some more freedom and the choice to not maybe work full time or work more for myself and also having the properties overseas paid outright maybe the choice for more freedom to use them or even partly live per year. Basically to aim towards freedom of options is a lot of motivation and building an income stream too and long term investments.

Yes I don't mind FCPT being considered a property asset and also interested in property, I think REIT's are good for this type of portfolio. The BigBox IT is different in a sector that is needed with how the marketplace is going so interested in seeing how this goes and the new EuroBox taking shape.

While there is a number of income IT's it is not all that I have invested in. Hope this makes sense and the logic seems reasonable

I am running down my P2P debt loans as well, 6-7K much in problems thanks to Collateral and as any comes back putting it into the IT's as well. I have a few k in property partner, but won't go too heavy with the liquidity.

I should of also said that my thinking as well with the Middlefield Canadian IT was to also go along with the North American IT I hold which Canada is just over 3% of in it. Canada is stable and the reasons I mentioned and I felt it would complete North America more along side the US based holding. But it was floating the idea and I can see I have plenty already which can be worked on.

Thanks for your replies, hope this makes more sense!

takesyourchances

ColdIron wrote: »

I've had MYI for about 3 years and it's done exactly what I bought it for, an above average yield of 4.5% - 5.5% with growing dividend which I use as income. Its charges are low and it provides some cover to Latin America/EM, including Fixed Income, that I don't have elsewhere. I'd be less impressed as a growth investor but then I wouldn't have bought it for that as it's not a growth (or WP) fund. Who knows what the future holds so I'll worry about the absolute share price when I need to sell it, hopefully not for some time to come

I have also had MYI for about 3 years and agree completely on how you explained thatm sums my reasons up as well for holding it and part of an overall portfolio.