LBC Gladstones

mark61120

Hello everyone,

I have received an LBC from Gladstones (see http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u369/markt120v/Letter%20before%20claim%20cleaned_zps6rfcdvvf.jpg
Sorry the url is so long!

The reason for the charge notice was that the ticket was upside down.

Anyway, I have read the various threads and stickies and come up with the following response. Could any knowledgeable people have a read and give me any pointers. Please feel free to ask for any clarification or background info.

Sirs,

The claim is not accepted as I do not consider that there has been a breach of the rules provided at the parking site.

These rules state that a valid parking ticket must be purchased to park on this site and be displayed clearly in your front windscreen.
I purchased a valid ticket and displayed it in my front windscreen. See the photograph provided by your client.
If the claimant is relying on their point that the expiry Date/time of the ticket were not visible, then this does not preclude the validity of the ticket, but merely demonstrates that the tickets provided are not fit for purpose in that the ticket was placed displaying the expiry date/time, but must have blown over on shutting the car door.

As you did not propose alternative dispute resolution, I do not accept the use of one and would prefer to present my arguments to court.

I intend to rely the following documentation if this matter presents to court:
The parking ticket purchased at the time of the alleged breach.
A further parking ticket from the same site purchased at a different time.
The International Parking Committee Code of Practice Version 5 (October 2016).
The letters sent to me by your client.

Your client has already had a full written response to this accusation from me (including any of the information you request). Please refer to your client for this information.

Your letter refers me to the Practice Direction for Pre-Action Conduct under the Civil Procedure Rules. Your letter does not appear to be compliant with the Practice Direction. It is in fact woefully defective.
I therefore request that you send me a Letter before Claim that is fully compliant with the Practice Direction (Pre-Action Conduct) Annex A
Viz:
(1) The claimant’s address has not been detailed;
(2) The basis on which the claim is made (i.e. why the claimant says I am liable).
(3) A clear summary of the facts on which the claim is based.
(5) An explanation of how the amount of financial loss has been calculated.
(6) Details of any funding arrangement (within the meaning of rule 43.2(1)(k) of the CPR) that has been entered into by the claimant.
2.2 There is not –
(1) A list the essential documents on which the claimant intends to rely.
(2) Any form of ADR that the claimant considers the most suitable nor an invite for me to agree to this.
2.3 As it is not know if I have legal representation, the letter does not refer me to the Practice Direction paragraph 4.
When this is supplied, please also confirm whether the intended action is founded on a contractual charge, a breach of a contract or trespass.

Please confirm that your client's contract with the land-holder includes specific authority to take legal action and that this will be provided to me and produced for the court.
I also require an explanation for the £160 charge. Including how it has been calculated and how your client has had a loss of income that equates to said charge. The Protection of Freedoms Act does not permit the claimant to recover a sum greater than the parking charge on the day before a Notice to Keeper was issued. The claimant cannot recover additional charges. I also believe that the claimant has not incurred the stated additional costs and it is put to strict proof that they have actually been incurred.
I also require a legible copy of the terms and conditions posted at the site.
It would be unreasonable to proceed with litigation before you have clarified your client's cause of action

Yours faithfully,


Thank you,
Mark

Fruitcake

I would amend your letter to say that a ticket was bought and displayed by an occupant of the car and not use the first person singular.

You might find this blog by the Parking-Prankster useful about an upside down ticket as it refers to a court case where the judge had a pop at the parking scammers for not using self adhesive tickets.

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/gladstones-pick-link-parkings-pocket.html

The judge dismissed the claim. He ruled that it was the responsibility of the parking company to provide sticky backed tickets and that he had already thrown out 6-10 of these type of cases which Link Parking had brought.

This case should be persuasive if it comes to court.

mark61120

Thanks Fruitcake.
I had already told the parking company that I was the driver and not the vehicle keeper as I did not want them bothering the keeper who has enough on their plate at the moment.

I have seen that article in the Prankster. It is a shame it cannot be an official transcript, but I suppose every little helps!

Half_way

Its not too late to go for a landowner cancellation, and every effort should be made to make the PPC into a nuisance for the landowner.
Plus if it does come to court, you can show that you have tried every effort in trying to avoid wasting the courts valuable time.

If you cant get a direct cancellation from the landowner, a simple something along the lines of WE ( the landowner) do not wish our agents to pursue the matter of the parking charge notice (PCN number/reference) through the court system using valuable court time
signed____ date:____ acting as a representative of /or the landowner

If you are armed with a landowner cancellation, or something like the above you can either tell the PPc to put up , that is take this to court as you wont be paying a penny otherwise, or shut up: that is either issue court proceedings, or you reserve the right to charge them for your time at upto £19 per hour or part there of in dealing with any further demands for money.

mark61120

I doubt very much that the landowner would be interested. This is an old bomb site in Liverpool and is purely used for parking revenue nt for the use of a shop or other premises.

beamerguy

mark61120 wrote: »

I doubt very much that the landowner would be interested. This is an old bomb site in Liverpool and is purely used for parking revenue nt for the use of a shop or other premises.

You have heard of "doubting thomas" ?

Somebody employs this vermin, your job is to find out who

mark61120

You are right, I will amend the letter to ask for the information regarding ownership of the land.

Guys_Dad

PPCs refer to their contract t&c. Is there anything in their signage that states which way up the ticket needs to be placed? I expect it says something on the ticket, but what precisely?

Half_way

As above someone will have employed the parking company/given them permission to operate on that land, either that or its a so called fly parking operation where that are acting without landowner authority/permission.
Another way to attack them is to take away their authority from the landowner, or make them a nuisance to the landowner.
Did you know that the landowner as principal is jointly and severely liable for the actions of his/her agents?

Another thing that may be of use would be some photos of any signage, together with the name of the original PPC odds on the signage will be deficient in some way

mark61120

The ticket says "Pay and Display". Nothing about which way up. In fact, the ticket has matching unique serial numbers on both sides, so it would have been possible for the parking attendant to verify the validity of the ticket no matter which way up it was.

I do have photos of the signage and again, they just say (as I put in the letter) 'a valid parking ticket must be purchased to park on this site and be displayed clearly in your front windscreen'. It also says 'Please check you vehicle and ticket before you leave'.

Personally, I think they deliberately keep using this type of flimsy ticket in order to try and charge people who's ticket gets flipped over. The scan I took of the ticket actually shows the date/time clearly through the ticket!

beamerguy

The case of an "upside down ticket" ???

The problem with Gladstones is that they believe scammers and that is why they fail in court.
Basically Gladstones don't understand and they lose in court

Why not invite this wild bunch (who the courts know all about) to take you to court about "an upside down" ticket