Dispute with landlord problem need advice

rreeve

When I moved into my flat I paid one months rent in advance and one months rent in lieu of notice. The landlord insisted it wasn't a deposit.

For a short time while I was out of work I claimed housing benefit and then I started a full-time job. However housing benefit was paid directly to my landlord at the end of the month and this is now an over-payment case.

The landlord is saying he will have to pay it back which is incorrect so I will set up a repayment plan with the benefits office tomorrow.

The problem is, I have given my notice on this flat and I intend to move out at the end of the month but I am 90% sure that my landlord will refuse to pay me the months rent in lieu that I paid at the start of my tenancy. Anyway, when I last spoke with my landlord he denied ever saying to me that I would get that money back (£540) when I leave even though I clearly remember him saying it.

So, here is my plan. I will refuse to hand over the keys and I will refuse to leave until he pays me that money back. I will sleep in the flat every other night to keep the property occupied. However, rather than going to court to evict me which is the right way to do it, he is the type of person who would change the locks on the flat while I'm at work.

This is a HUGE concern of mine and I don't know my rights in this situation. I don't think he is legally allowed to change the locks like that while I'm at work but still occupying the flat as a tenant who is having a dispute with him. (My landlord)

WHAT DO I DO?
If he does change the locks while I'm at work what do I do?
Do I call the police? Am I allowed to force entry? who do I turn to?

I need some advice on this because I don't know my rights or his rights if he takes this kind of action.

anselld

You have given notice. If you fail to leave he can charge you double rent.

Regarding the locks, if you have given notice and removed all your possessions he may well assume that you have vacated the property and failed to return the key. It would not seem unreasonable for him to change the locks.

You have concocted a pointless plan in response to a situation which has not even arisen yet. You should leave as planned, return keys, provide the L with some proof that the Council will not be reclaiming a months rent from him and then see how he responds. Letter before action and small claims court if he does not return the money.

With hindsight "rent in lieu of notice" is meaningless. If L refuses to call it a deposit then look for somewhere else.

Pixie5740

In the words of Tony Stark, "not a great plan."

As already pointed out if you fail to vacate the property after your notice expires then your landlord can claim double rent from you under the Distress of Rent Act 1737. It's also a needlessly complicated plan when there are far simpler, and less expensive to you, avenues available.

If your landlord doesn't return the money then all you need to do is send a simple Letter Before Action and if that doesn't work take action i.e. take your landlord to court. In fact I'm not entirely convinced that calling the money "rent in lieu of notice," means it's not a deposit. If that money can be classed as a deposit then that gives you a bit more ammunition.

Guest101

rreeve wrote: »

When I moved into my flat I paid one months rent in advance and one months rent in lieu of notice. The landlord insisted it wasn't a deposit.

For a short time while I was out of work I claimed housing benefit and then I started a full-time job. However housing benefit was paid directly to my landlord at the end of the month and this is now an over-payment case.

The landlord is saying he will have to pay it back which is incorrect so I will set up a repayment plan with the benefits office tomorrow.

The problem is, I have given my notice on this flat and I intend to move out at the end of the month but I am 90% sure that my landlord will refuse to pay me the months rent in lieu that I paid at the start of my tenancy. Anyway, when I last spoke with my landlord he denied ever saying to me that I would get that money back (£540) when I leave even though I clearly remember him saying it.

So, here is my plan. I will refuse to hand over the keys and I will refuse to leave until he pays me that money back. I will sleep in the flat every other night to keep the property occupied. However, rather than going to court to evict me which is the right way to do it, he is the type of person who would change the locks on the flat while I'm at work.

This is a HUGE concern of mine and I don't know my rights in this situation. I don't think he is legally allowed to change the locks like that while I'm at work but still occupying the flat as a tenant who is having a dispute with him. (My landlord)

WHAT DO I DO?
If he does change the locks while I'm at work what do I do?
Do I call the police? Am I allowed to force entry? who do I turn to?

I need some advice on this because I don't know my rights or his rights if he takes this kind of action.

If you stay after your notice the LL can simply charge you double rent.


Why don't you just go to court and let them sort it out?

G_M

As others have said, your plan is mad.

Either you leave as per your notice period, stop paying rent, and claim back what you are owed.

Or you stay, continue to pay rent, risk being charged double rent for failing to leave, and your debts will mount.

As for the 'rent in lieu of notice' I have no idea what this is meant to mean legally, but it appears to be an attempt to avoid deposit registration.

1) If this money was a deposit
a) it should have been registered, wasn't, so you can claim the penalty
b) it should now be returned, less any damage you did to the property

2) If it was rent, then since you have given proper notice (I assume), there is no question of the LL being entitled to 'rent in lieu of notice'. It is simply 'rent'.

You should therefore calculate how many months rent the LL was owed overall, and how much he received (from you and/or HB). If you over-paid, you claim it back. If you under-paid, then you now pay it. If you payed exactly the right amount, no one owes anyone anything.

For more on deposits, see
* Deposits: payment, protection and return

For more on what notice you should have given, see

* Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

rreeve

G_M wrote: »

As others have said, your plan is mad.

Either you leave as per your notice period, stop paying rent, and claim back what you are owed.

Or you stay, continue to pay rent, risk being charged double rent for failing to leave, and your debts will mount.

As for the 'rent in lieu of notice' I have no idea what this is meant to mean legally, but it appears to be an attempt to avoid deposit registration.

1) If this money was a deposit
a) it should have been registered, wasn't, so you can claim the penalty
b) it should now be returned, less any damage you did to the property

2) If it was rent, then since you have given proper notice (I assume), there is no question of the LL being entitled to 'rent in lieu of notice'. It is simply 'rent'.

You should therefore calculate how many months rent the LL was owed overall, and how much he received (from you and/or HB). If you over-paid, you claim it back. If you under-paid, then you now pay it. If you payed exactly the right amount, no one owes anyone anything.

For more on deposits, see
* Deposits: payment, protection and return

For more on what notice you should have given, see

* Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

When all said and done my rent is up to date except for £80.
When I originally moved into the property I paid 2 months rent money in advance 2 x £540 = £1080 The landlord said it is one months rent in advance and one months rent in lieu of notice. I asked if that meant it was a deposit and he said this is not a deposit. At the time I thought he was being very pedantic about it because he kept saying it is not a deposit. He made it very clear to me that it was not a deposit. In hindsight I can now see why.
He has called it one months rent in lieu of notice to avoid having to place the money in a protected account and instead keep it in his own pocket.
Anyway back to my current situation. I gave a written notice to my landlord at the end of January saying I will be moving out at the end of February, beginning of march.
Today I arranged to pay back the over-payment and the council is sending a letter to my landlord to inform they will not take the money from my landlord.
I sent an email to my landloard explaining everything. He also tried to deny he had any housing benefit since early december so I sent him a statement that proves the HB money was paid up to the end of January. My landlord is ignoring me now.
With all of this I think it is HIGHLY unlikely that my landlord will give me the money owed.
So when I take the landlord to court for my money, can I argue that the month in lieu of notice was technically a deposit?

anselld

rreeve wrote: »

So when I take the landlord to court for my money, can I argue that the month in lieu of notice was technically a deposit?

It really doesn't matter what he calls it. If you have paid more than the agreed rent for the agreed period and there are no damages, etc then the rest should be returned, whatever it is called.

If you want to claim 3x non-protection penalty however, I don't know. It may well be a credible threat.

G_M

The LL called it rent. So I would treat it as rent.

So when you moved in, you paid two months rent in advance. That means you could have stopped paying rent 2 months before the tenancy ends (as those 2 months were already paid). Unfortunately it's toolate for that now, so you will have to use the courts to claim back that rent.

I'm not sure why you say "my rent is up to date except for £80" but using my advice above, you seem to have overpaid one month (£540) but owe the £80, so in fact the LL owes you £460.



This may not apply, but are you sure your notice was correct?
* was there a fixed term to the tenancy?
* if yes, what (EXACT) date did it end/will it end?
* what exact date did you serve your notice (serve, not send)?
* what exact date did you give for the notice to expire (the tenancy end)?

Hopefully you got it all right, but if not the LL could claim rent in lieu of notice!

EdwardB

It is a deposit, the law is VERY clear on that, calling it something else is not a get out of jail free card.

If it had been in lieu of notice you would not have had to pay the last month's rent, not that it would have been a defence.

I think best to leave when you said you would and to have someone there to do inventory with you.

I would also video the place because a friend of mind had her landlord trash the place and accuse her, luckily she had the video and she reported him to the police because it was a fraud on her deposit.

Anyway, you have up to three years to get it but law may change between now and then, I sent you details of people that do it without going to Court.

You always have to be careful with the the no win no fee crowd as they just want to rack up costs.

Same as those "injured in accident" mob

Main thing is that you know do you not need to hold him to ransom

Out of interest had you not given notice, kept up rent repayments then the tenancy agreement would become a Statutory one and he would need to issue an Section 21 notice, that notice could have been voided by informing the Court of the deposit protection failure.

If you were to have stayed you can change the locks (£5 off ebay) but if a Landlord changes the locks during your tenancy without issuing a section 21 or having a court order, you can call the police and get a locksmith to break back in, landlord then has to pay you for locksmith and could be fined big bucks.