Parking Eye = Crown Wharf Walsall

Adzenca

Fruitcake wrote: »

Sorry, I was typing in a rush before I went out. I meant appealed as keeper only. That way you get additional protection using the Protection of Freedom Act.

It doesn't matter that the driver no longer has the ticket.

Forget the discount which means they hope you will cave in and pay because you are daft. You aren't daft otherwise you wouldn't have come here and used the correct BPA appeal template. Debt collectors have no powers and can only lawfully send you poor quality bog paper. The NEWBIES thread explains this.
You can't get a CCJ unless you go to court, and lose, and don't pay the costs awarded against you, and have a CCJ against you, and don't pay that. Note all the "ands." You are nowhere near court. The idea is to kill this at PoPLA, cost the scammers money, and cost you nothing.

Now you wait for your PoPLA code then construct your PoPLA appeal and post it here for the experts to check first.

One of your main points will be lack of grace periods (note the plural) which is a breach of the BPA CoP. There are two grace periods in the CoP. One at the beginning of the alleged parking period and one at the end. Look up version 6 from 2015 of the CoP and quote the relevant section where parking lie have failed to comply with this.

Other points will include inadequate signage, not the landowner, and no standing to issue charges. If the NTK does not fully meet the requirements of the POFA 2012, then that will be another appeal point as well. Something as small as the parking scammers not putting the period of parking (not just from ... to ...., but the exact time interval between them) means the POFA has not been complied with, therefore there can be no keeper liability.

You need to carefully compare every single word and line of the NTK with every part of the relevant section of the POFA to determine where they have got it wrong, and there is your winning PoPLA appeal point. You just need to spell it out for the PoPLA assessors as some of them do not seem to understand how an Act of Parliament actually works.

One of your main points will be lack of grace periods (note the plural) which is a breach of the BPA CoP. There are two grace periods in the CoP. One at the beginning of the alleged parking period and one at the end. Look up version 6 from 2015 of the CoP and quote the relevant section where parking lie have failed to comply with this.

I looked up the Code of Practice - they make explicit the 10 minute grace period at the end but nothing explicit of the grace period when entering the car park.

If you remove the 10 minute grace period - that makes for an £85 charge for a 2 minute overstay which is excessive!

I've been doing some reading. The ParkingEye vs. Beavis judgement was based on a free car park and PE claiming winning on "Commercial Justification". Parking at the Crown Wharf Retail Park is not free, users have to pay in the first instance.

So does this may the case different from Beavis?

Other points will include inadequate signage, not the landowner, and no standing to issue charges. If the NTK does not fully meet the requirements of the POFA 2012, then that will be another appeal point as well. Something as small as the parking scammers not putting the period of parking (not just from ... to ...., but the exact time interval between them) means the POFA has not been complied with, therefore there can be no keeper liability

What does NTK mean?

How do I go about your suggestion of checking things against the "NTK"? I guess this comes once I obtain the PoPLA number for appeal?
I feel terrible that the driver is going through this, but as the registered keeper I must persist as I think it's really unfair.


Having been roundly IGNORED by Broadgate Estates, it's unlikely I or the driver of the vehicle will ever use the shops on the Retail Park ever again. Without consumers they'd be no shops, without shops Broadgate Estates would be out of business. I as registered keeper of said vehicle and the driver feel they ([Removed by Forum Team] of Broadgate Estates) treated me with contempt.

Adzenca

By the way, I really could do without this stress. I'm reading on here and elsewhere that PoPLA reject appeals. As Crown Wharf is a popular place for PE discussion here, It feels completely overwhelmingly against our favour (the driver and me).

Just distressing.

Adzenca

I've contacted Next (one of the retailers on the complex) who suggested I contact Parking Eye via the phone number on the PE paperwork who they reckon will be able to assist me!!!!!!

Apparently the driver of the vehicle was using Next on the day of the fine.

I'm so annoyed, I've told the driver to stop shopping at Next. I'm going to do the same and close my account - I am so angry.

Coupon-mad

Adzenca wrote: »

By the way, I really could do without this stress. I'm reading on here and elsewhere that PoPLA reject appeals.

POPLA appeals here are almost all won.

Did you miss the fact that the BPA grace period isn't ''10 minutes'' it is a MINIMUM of ten minutes as time to leave after paid-for time. Obviously you can't have tele-ported into the parking space and paid at the machine in one second flat...!

Search the forum for 'POPLA Kelvin observation period' to find examples already written recently, citing the words of Kelvin Reynolds of the BPA where he makes it clear that the observation period to park and then pay is a separate period of time from a grace period to leave.

PE are likely to pull out of the POPLA process once they see a long and well-worked POPLA appeal, like those you will find when you search (which are based on the POPLA appeal template wording in the NEWBIES thread post #3).

This is likely to be easier than you think.

catfunt

What Coupon Mad said.

Please believe us - there is no need to get stressed.

With a little bit of reading up, and guidance from the learned members on here, you can beat this relatively easily. It may seem like a mountain right now, but believe me, it's not.

Think of it as a life-learning experience.. A number of regulars on here started out being in exactly the same position as you.

One thing to bear in mind - the POPLA appeal will not be on what happened on the day, but challengeing the legal basis of the parking charge - signage, the right to issue parking charges and so on.

Adzenca

Thanks for all your reassurances - I'm still upset.

So all the retailers I approached in person refused to help .. refused is a strong word .. DECLINED to assist. Instead I was directed to the Parking Eye customer services hut. I didn't go and approach them as I'm guessing you'd have advised me not to enter into any verbal dialogue with these people?? So instead I looked around and took pictures.

I wish I knew how to insert images. There are no signs at the entrance detailing fees or charges - just asking people to pay and display and the time of the charges.

Anyway, I'm on the verge of paying this invoice as it's in my name as registered keeper. I'm so deflated and upset. I will never ever ever use the car park nor will I shop on the retail park. Nor will I purchase goods from all the retailers who ignored my requests for help ... so that's a large number of retailers, but hey! The driver has been advised to do the same.

Adzenca

Coupon-mad wrote: »

POPLA appeals here are almost all won.

Did you miss the fact that the BPA grace period isn't ''10 minutes'' it is a MINIMUM of ten minutes as time to leave after paid-for time. Obviously you can't have tele-ported into the parking space and paid at the machine in one second flat...!

Search the forum for 'POPLA Kelvin observation period' to find examples already written recently, citing the words of Kelvin Reynolds of the BPA where he makes it clear that the observation period to park and then pay is a separate period of time from a grace period to leave.

PE are likely to pull out of the POPLA process once they see a long and well-worked POPLA appeal, like those you will find when you search (which are based on the POPLA appeal template wording in the NEWBIES thread post #3).

This is likely to be easier than you think.

By the way, spoke to the driver of the vehicle, they recall looking at the ticket upon going back to the car and the parking ticket had 10:12am on it. PE are claiming my car exited at 10:06am. However the driver states they hadn't bought a ticket straight away as they suffer with an ongoing ankle complaint which makes it difficult to walk sometimes - the driver isn't registered disabled though, but is under the care of a hospital consultant.

Just a pity the ticket was thrown away!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

Adzenca

Hi,

Still no word from Parking Eye. Does the process usually take this long???

Also would appreciate some advice on the posts I made yesterday :o

Thank you

Coupon-mad

They have 35 days to reply to an appeal. You got the auto acknowledgement page when you clicked 'submit' so they HAVE acknowledged it.

I wish I knew how to insert images. There are no signs at the entrance detailing fees or charges

Host your pics in tinypic or photobucket or Dropbox, then post the URL here but change 'http to 'hxxp' to make it a broken link (we will convert it back).

However the driver states they hadn't bought a ticket straight away as they suffer with an ongoing ankle complaint which makes it difficult to walk sometimes - the driver isn't registered disabled though, but is under the care of a hospital consultant.

I would email the consultant's letter to PE as a follow up (explaining the appeal is already lodged but this is further information):

info@parkingeye.co.uk

and to the Managing Agents to follow up on the complaint already lodged. Make sure they PCN number is in the subject line.

Was this PCN received within 14 days and does it have the 29 days 'POFA' paragraph about keeper liability?

Adzenca

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Was this PCN received within 14 days and does it have the 29 days 'POFA' paragraph about keeper liability?

Yes.

Coupon-mad wrote: »

They have 35 days to reply to an appeal. You got the auto acknowledgement page when you clicked 'submit' so they HAVE acknowledged it.

The appeal was rejected - received notification today

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Host your pics in tinypic or photobucket or Dropbox, then post the URL here but change 'http to 'hxxp' to make it a broken link (we will convert it back).

I'll try later when home

Coupon-mad wrote: »

I would email the consultant's letter to PE as a follow up (explaining the appeal is already lodged but this is further information):

info@parkingeye.co.uk

and to the Managing Agents to follow up on the complaint already lodged. Make sure they PCN number is in the subject line.

The driver doesn't want to reveal their name or address details - sending medical information would do this? They're unlikely to accept it without details??

Also, is that still possible now the rejected appeal has been received?


Thank you ...