Electric cars

Martyn1981

Car_54 wrote: »

Don't forget that the share price fell by 30% over a one month period recently.

Too approx ten times its IPO price.

Car_54

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Too approx ten times its IPO price.

Which is irrelevant to anyone except those who bought shares in that IPO. It would be no consolation at all to anyone who had invested in early August.

AdrianC

Martyn1981 wrote: »

TM3 production is already at approx 250,000pa, and they are aiming for 500,000.

Umm, optimistic.



https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2018-tesla-tracker/
90,500 cars have been built to date.
Just over half of those have been built since the end of Q2, when Tesla confirmed 41,030.That's slightly over 200,000 cars/year annualised.



Q3 ends next Sunday - yes, those are Bloomberg's educated estimates, but we'll get a confirmed figure for this quarter with the financials a few days into October.


This week was the second-worst week this quarter, below 3,500. At that rate, that's 182k. And the trend has been downwards through September.

Tesla is reinvesting in the business

Perhaps. But it's not their money they're investing. And their reserves are shrinking.

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

At that rate, that's 182k.

Is anyone doing better?

Martyn1981

Car_54 wrote: »

Which is irrelevant to anyone except those who bought shares in that IPO. It would be no consolation at all to anyone who had invested in early August.

Interesting, you keep avoiding the issue of capital growth, and think that investment returns can only be made on profits, not re-investment!

Perhaps you would have preferred Tesla stay small, at around 2,000 vehicles per month, and making profits ...... though I'm not sure how stopping forward progress furthers the goal of EV expansion.

Martyn1981

Through all the fog and FUD, sometimes we forget just how far Tesla, and EV's have come this last decade, so here's a piece on the company's growth. I just wish 10 western marques would match them, then we'd see some serious change.

10 Years After 1st Car, Tesla Production Rate = 300,000–400,000* Cars A Year

Name another automaker that has seen such a large production ramp that fast.**

Now, consider how ridiculous the claims are that Tesla can’t mass produce cars or can’t quickly ramp up production.

Aside from the 10 year marker, perhaps more notable is that Tesla brought its first mass production car — the Model S — to market in 2012.*** That means that in a little more than 6 years, Tesla has gone from delivering its first mass produced car to mass producing cars at a rate of approximately 300,000–400,000 units per year. No one has ramped up production so dramatically so quickly in history!

Car_54

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Interesting, you keep avoiding the issue of capital growth, and think that investment returns can only be made on profits, not re-investment!

Perhaps you would have preferred Tesla stay small, at around 2,000 vehicles per month, and making profits ...... though I'm not sure how stopping forward progress furthers the goal of EV expansion.

I'm not avoiding the issue of capital growth: rather you are avoiding the fact that any such growth is dependent on a host of factors (many unconnected with Tesla) is are very precarious. Investing in any start-up (not just Tesla) is a gamble, especially if it seen as heavily dependent on one individual.



Those shareholders who bought in early August (for example) have had their fingers very badly burnt, and may have a long wait to see any capital growth.



As for preferring Tesla to stay small, I can safely say that is a matter of complete indifference.

AdrianC

It's also the fifteenth anniversary of BYD's first car.

Tesla have built a cumulative total of about 400,000 cars over their first decade. They certainly aren't going to make anything like "300-400k" during FY2018, maybe 250k if they're lucky.

On the other hand, BYD sold nearly 450,000 cars in 2009, and more than 500,000 cars in 2010 - just six-seven years after their first car.

I'm a bit surprised you've forgotten about them, especially in the context of this thread, because they built more electric cars than anybody else - worldwide - in 2017, for the third year in a row, with north of 108,000 cars. Care to guess who was second, with 103k? I bet you can get it in one... The big difference is that BYD sold several times that many non-electrics, too.


From that article...

Missing production goals for a few months when you’re shooting for Mars is not necessarily a sign that you are not seriously freakin’ good at ramping up mass production

Umm, Tesla aren't "shooting for Mars". Are CleanTechnica really so clueless that they can't separate Tesla from SpaceX? Or are they suggesting that Tesla and Musk are somehow indivisible and inseparable? Cult of Personality, much? That rarely works out well in the long run.

Martyn1981

Car_54 wrote: »

I'm not avoiding the issue of capital growth: rather you are avoiding the fact that any such growth is dependent on a host of factors (many unconnected with Tesla) is are very precarious. Investing in any start-up (not just Tesla) is a gamble, especially if it seen as heavily dependent on one individual.



Those shareholders who bought in early August (for example) have had their fingers very badly burnt, and may have a long wait to see any capital growth.



As for preferring Tesla to stay small, I can safely say that is a matter of complete indifference.

The company could stay small and pay out profits from the S & X, or invest in the TM3 and lead to a large increase in capital value.

No idea why you can't see both options, but the investors can.

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

I'm a bit surprised you've forgotten about them,

Not forgotten at all, I simply didn't know they were a western marque? I guess it all depends how far you go, be it in needing to post negativity, or global travel in a westerly direction.

Cheer up, EV's and Tesla are doing fine.