T&Cs

The_Deep

Check them out on Companies House Beta, I cannot post the link.

Coupon-mad

Is his local Court Truro? If so then he has less chance, got to be honest.

And I would not argue 'disproportionate' because it is an overstay, rather like the Beavis case (a few mins? after paid-for time?).

As per the Newbies thread, am I right in thinking he should wait until 26 days before appealing, and that the 14-day cut-off point for the discount rate is a red herring?

Depends if the PCN says appeals must be in by day 21, or day 28. if the former, then either send it sooner (online appeal form) or wait for the NTK then appeal.

Sounds like he won't cope with court. The entire industry needs removing from the UK, banning like clamping. People like him are victims and this should not happen to people.

Canary21

Ah - good point! Yes, it says 21 days on the back. That's answered that question...


As to the second question, no, he lives miles away, in Devon. Would it be a court round there that he would go to?


In the meantime, I've just been told the following... the pub claims that it has leased the car park to the PPC. I'm sure that's not the case, but assuming for a moment that it HAS leased it to the PPC, does that undermine any claim by the PPC that it is looking to recover a loss of earnings for its client (ie, it doesn't have a client who has suffered any loss)?


(If it is then admitted at a later date that the pub DOES still own the car park, the driver can point out that s/he tried to speak to the pub from the outset but was told it wasn't anything to do with it.)


Or is that clutching at straws?

Coupon-mad

he lives miles away, in Devon. Would it be a court round there that he would go to?

Good! Yes he gets his local Court and it seems that AS are more 'comfortable' with Judges at Truro.

I've just been told the following... the pub claims that it has leased the car park to the PPC. I'm sure that's not the case, but assuming for a moment that it HAS leased it to the PPC, does that undermine any claim by the PPC that it is looking to recover a loss of earnings for its client (ie, it doesn't have a client who has suffered any loss)?

Surely AS are not pretending they are trying to recoup a loss? I doubt it, that approach has no legs - they will be more likely to be spouting the Beavis case - and you should not be arguing anything involving the words:

- loss
- GPEOL
- disproportionate

Half_way

The pub would have taken on the parking company to act as its agents, and as such they can instruct the PPC to cancel any charge.

Was your friend a customer of the pub at the time?

Canary21

Yes, he was a customer, and I'm sure you're right about it being within the pub's gift to cancel the charge.


But they say it's nothing to do with them.


Anyway, I've persuaded my mate to pursue this, so I'll follow the Newbies thread and do it for him.


Thanks for all your help so far.


Just one quick query, though... should I use the PPC's online form for "contesting" the notice, or the email address they give for "complaining about the validity of the charge"?

safarmuk

I would keep up the conversation with the pub - a lot of Landowners do not understand what they have signed up to and what it does to their customers. They get a glossy brochure which says "we will protect your car park against people who should not be using it" and think "well that sounds reasonable" ... they don't realise that genuine customers get ticketed and that the appeals service won't help the motorist quite as much as they imagined.

In parallel to all the good stuff you are being told here by C-M, TD, FC etc. keep the lines of communication with the pub open and if nothing else educate them as to what they have signed up to. Most people are reasonable (believe it or not) but just don't understand yet. I have had success with this approach. You have several avenues - email, social media if they have it (but obviously don't give away any significant details), local papers, letters pages in those papers etc.

Can you name the pub? Is it part of a chain or an independent?

Umkomaas

Just one quick query, though... should I use the PPC's online form for "contesting" the notice, or the email address they give for "complaining about the validity of the charge"?

You are contesting the notice. We advise always to follow the directions for the method of appeal given by the PPC on its NtK/NtD. Otherwise it gives them the opportunity to say the appeal was not submitted.

However, if you're still uncertain, send the appeal to both addresses, then you're covered.

Don't forget to put the keepers name and address in the appeal.

Canary21

These are the questions I guess I should have already asked. It's not ideal trying to help a friend who is hundreds of miles away and not online!

It turns out the pub belongs to a well-known Cornish brewery, so contact is now being made with them.

In the meantime, I've now been told that the ticket was issued during the 10 minutes it took them to pop inside, buy a round and get some change. Is that worth putting in the initial challenge, or should the keeper stick to the wording in the Newbies thread?

Coupon-mad

I would put that in (EXCEPT miss out 'buy a round') and describe getting the change to pay and display as taking 'no more than approx 5 - 10 minutes... which fits within the Code of Practice and industry standard 10 minute grace period to comply with terms (Pay and Display requiring change to 'comply').