Taking legal action against property developer

da_rule

So the bungalow probable has a seperate title.


As you have quoted from the title document for the shop/petrol station it would appear they do have a right to use the road, during day light, for purposes connected with the property. Delivering stock would certainly fall within this.


The creating an obstruction clause is a bit vague, as how long does something have to be there before it is an obstruction?


It also appears that the person names in this title document (be that the current owner or a previous owner) consructed the road and that the shop/petrol station should be/is contributing 10% of the upkeep costs of the part of the road they have a right over.

Gorideb4

sparky130a wrote: »

Hmm. Here's an idea.

Sat Nav. I recently did a job that was on a road with a cul de sac. We had to drill under the railway line behind said dead end.

Behind that was a Sainsburys. In the 9 months we were there the number of HGV's that would come down the road insisting they could get to the store was unreal. A couple of them i even had to physically show them the rail track before they'd believe me.

Turns out it was agency drivers using a well known make of Sat Nav.

Thanks for your response Sparky.

Think this may be causing some of the issues as the roadway does lead to the back of the shop as well as our houses. Will definitely check it out.

When we have asked drivers in the past why they have used the road they nearly all respond by saying "the shop told me!"

moneyistooshorttomention

Gorideb4 wrote: »

Yes the shop was there before buying the house. They have a large forecourt and were told all deliveries take place in this area. The planning submission for the new houses highlight that deliveries are made on the petrol forecourt also.

The forecourt is vast is so has more than enough space to receive such deliveries

I am mindful that he is running a business but simply do not want 20 tonne lorries regularly using a road I am responsible for the upkeep of.

If the planning permission for the houses specifically highlights that deliveries are made on the petrol forecourt - then couldn't you all just do an official solicitor letter on behalf of all 5 houses (say £100 divided by 5 = £20 per house) to the owner of the shop reminding them of what is down in writing re this point and they should then stop the lorries from doing this?

Hopefully that would be sufficient to stop this but, if it wasn't, then I'm guessing an injunction against the shop-owner allowing lorries to do that should do the trick?

davidmcn

Gorideb4 wrote: »

To the transferee constructing at its own expense the initial access Way and estate road in accordance with planning consent

To the transferee paying to the Trasferor one tenth of the cost of maintenance and upkeep of that part of the estate road comprised within green land )estate road)

Who are the transferor/transferee? I'm guessing that the transferee is the developer of the houses, and the retained land is the shop? In which case it sounds like the shop does have retained rights over the road:

There are reserved out of the property for the benefit of the whole and every part of the retained land...a right of way over and along the estate road at all times and for all purposes for the benefit of the retained land

As for whether your solicitor ought to have pointed it out - I'm not sure it would necessarily ring alarm bells. It's obviously a development involving both residential and commercial properties, so to be expected that they both have rights of access.

Gorideb4

da_rule wrote: »

So the bungalow probable has a seperate title.


As you have quoted from the title document for the shop/petrol station it would appear they do have a right to use the road, during day light, for purposes connected with the property. Delivering stock would certainly fall within this.

Yes agreed, my solicitor made this point to me

The creating an obstruction clause is a bit vague, as how long does something have to be there before it is an obstruction?

I agreed too vague furthermore my solicitor said would be very hard to enforce or challenge.


It also appears that the person names in this title document (be that the current owner or a previous owner) consructed the road and that the shop/petrol station should be/is contributing 10% of the upkeep costs of the part of the road they have a right over.

My solicitor (different from conveyancer)recommended that we did not agree to 10% of upkeep cost as it is not proportional to use

To get back to my original point,do you think that I could persue property developer or conveyancer for compensation? I was not told about any of these issues when purchasing the house and obviously if I sell I need to be open about it to prospective buyers and take a hit. Doesn't seem right.

Gorideb4

davidmcn wrote: »

Who are the transferor/transferee? I'm guessing that the transferee is the developer of the houses, and the retained land is the shop? In which case it sounds like the shop does have retained rights over the road:

assumptions above are correct



As for whether your solicitor ought to have pointed it out - I'm not sure it would necessarily ring alarm bells. It's obviously a development involving both residential and commercial properties, so to be expected that they both have rights of access.

indeed the shop and bungalow are one building, the property is L shaped one section shop and the other residential quarters. When you look at the bungalow there is nothing that suggests that it would used for reviewing deliveries.

Having said that my conveyancer would have had access to the title documents and therefore surely alerted me to these issues.

da_rule

It's not really up to you whether to agree to the 10% or not, it has been agreed by your predecessors in title.


Claim against the developer = No. Assuming that they supplied your converyancer with relevant title documents it is up to the conveyancor to then question anything on the title. The developer then can either answer these questions or not, and it is then the buyers choice whether they proceed.


Conveyancer = Tricky. You'll need to dig out everything they sent you. If they ever sent you anything which contained this covenant (whether that was a copy of the title document or whether it was included on your transfer document) then you'd probably struggle, as they have informed you. That is why most letters always tell you to contact them if you're not sure of anything.

Gorideb4

da_rule wrote: »

It's not really up to you whether to agree to the 10% or not, it has been agreed by your predecessors in title.


Claim against the developer = No. Assuming that they supplied your converyancer with relevant title documents it is up to the conveyancor to then question anything on the title. The developer then can either answer these questions or not, and it is then the buyers choice whether they proceed.


Conveyancer = Tricky. You'll need to dig out everything they sent you. If they ever sent you anything which contained this covenant (whether that was a copy of the title document or whether it was included on your transfer document) then you'd probably struggle, as they have informed you. That is why most letters always tell you to contact them if you're not sure of anything.

I did not recall seeing a copy of the covenant during the process, I will check though. I obtained my copy by contacting land registry.

getmore4less

You were there on the ground and saw the shop and other facilities.

what questions did you ask your conveyancor to investigate.

it would not be obvious from docs alone.

Another angle is to notify the companies making deliveries so they are aware that their lorries are damaging property(the road).

Also notify the owner(s) of the roads that you expect them to pursue the companies that are damaging the road.

da_rule

The developer would only really be liable if they actively mislead you (i.e. lied in answer to a question). Not telling you something or refusing to answer a question which may prejudice the sale is not misleading you. It is the job of your conveyancer to check these things and report any potential issues to you and for you to then decide how you want to proceed. The conveyancer has a duty towards you as their client, the developer does not.


It is worth checking through everything you have been sent. Did you make copies of documents that you were asked to sign and return as the relevant information may be on these? Also, has been said, a road at the back of shop with an access right to that shop would be relatively standard so may not have raised any alarms. To be honest, I was more surprised at the start of this post where you seemed to be suggesting that there was no right reserved for the shop.