PCN from Parking Eye - Preston Parking PCN appeal turned down by PE

discontent64

Hello. I am new to the site but have read the NEWBIES information. There is a huge amount of information that is quite bewildering.

I think we have done things wrong to this point and would like some guidance on how to move things back so we are more likely to succeed. Hope you guys can help us.

Briefly, 2 parking incidents within 4 days (please do not go down that route of second time being avoidable!).
Neither my wife or I are in the legal profession but she does have to go to court as part of her job.

Lawson Street (Upper) Car Park near the courts is operated by Parking Eye. We have been unable to find out who owns the land from either the City Council or the Police who disposed of the land several years ago to a property developer who passed this onto someone else.

First PCN. Paid the fee for 3 hours. Held up in court by the Judge. Overstay of an hour and a half. Letter arrived asking for £60. We wrote back explaining that this was disproportionate and also that the case that should have been discharged within an hour or two was contested, leading to a delay. PE refused our appeal and so we need to know how to progress.

Second PCN. Paid a fee for 3 hours but mistakenly entered wrong registration number. Noted the mistake when back at car and wrote a note on the paper ticket and put this inside the windscreen. Left before the time ran out. PE sent a PCN by post saying no fee had been paid. We appealed on the grounds that a fee had been paid and the incorrect reg number entered and had there been a human they would have noticed this. PE refused the appeal and so we want to know what to do. (We forgot to add that the reg number entered related to our vehicle that was scrapped over 2 years ago and hence could not have been parked).

Your help would be much appreciated.

Looking forward to hearing how we can progress. In hindsight we should have signed in and read the threads of great advice before sending the letters BUT we were totally annoyed that the PCNs had been issued...especially for the second one where the fee had been paid for a vehicle.

Many thanks.

pappa_golf

2007/8 it was released from police property

planning aplication

06/2013/0440
Change of use from car park ancillary to former police station to Pay and
Display car park
Type: Full application
Officer: Janet Filbin
Ward: Town Centre
Parish:
Upper Car Park Lawson Street Preston
25/06/2013
Determination Type:
Delegated
Applicant /Agent
ParkingEye Ltd 40 Eaton Avenue Matrix Park Buckshaw Village Chorley PR7 7NA

you need to contact preston CC to find out the owner

however over the years PE have taken a lot of people to court

Coupon-mad

Lawson Street (Upper) Car Park near the courts is operated by Parking Eye. We have been unable to find out who owns the land from either the City Council or the Police.

Try the Land Registry if you need to.

First PCN. Paid the fee for 3 hours. Held up in court by the Judge. Overstay of an hour and a half. Letter arrived asking for £60. We wrote back explaining that this was disproportionate and also that the case that should have been discharged within an hour or two was contested, leading to a delay. PE refused our appeal and so we need to know how to progress.

POPLA stage, as per the templates in post #3 of the NEWBIES thread. Make it LONG.

Second PCN. Paid a fee for 3 hours but mistakenly entered wrong registration number. Noted the mistake when back at car and wrote a note on the paper ticket and put this inside the windscreen.

Left before the time ran out. PE sent a PCN by post saying no fee had been paid. We appealed on the grounds that a fee had been paid and the incorrect reg number entered and had there been a human they would have noticed this.

PE refused the appeal and so we want to know what to do. (We forgot to add that the reg number entered related to our vehicle that was scrapped over 2 years ago and hence could not have been parked).

POPLA again.

Show us your draft POPLA appeals, if easier, split them so one PCN is in a new thread.

discontent64

Many thanks for the very rapid responses.
I will certainly post the communications, but that will be tomorrow.
I will separate the threads so we do not get mixed messages.
I tried to find the template under #3 of NEWBIES but was unsuccessful. I need to get to grips with how to use the forum as soon as possible.

I have tried to find out the owner of the land. The planning applications link gave the full application by ParkingEye, and many forms in support. The landowner was identified as a limited company in 2013 (Imperial Management Co. Limited), but a search on Companies House Website does not show any company with that name (also the person making the application was not a director of ParkingEye, but I suspect that is not important). Planning permission was granted on a temporary basis for 2 years. A retrospective application was made by ParkingEye in February 2016, but this does not even give an owner. However, it does clearly state that ParkingEye do not own the land but has permission from the owner

The councillor has been contacted, but with the holiday, it will be early January before anything comes from this.

So, a potential route of appeal is the contract side of things, but I am not sure of the order of things - do we request the contract from ParkingEye before the appeal to Popla? Or carry on with our appeal anyway?

Not sure if this is relevant. In the one case, the original letter shows an entry and exit time but does not provide details of HOW LONG I supposedly overstayed, nor the charges/cost of being on site for the period.

I will post more tomorrow when I have been able to scan letters etc.

Coupon-mad

do we request the contract from ParkingEye before the appeal to Popla? Or carry on with our appeal anyway?

Appeal anyway; you will find one of the POPLA appeal template points asks for proof of landowner contract/authority.

My signature tells you where to click to get back to page one, so how can you be unsuccessful in locating post #3 of the NEWBIES READ THESE FAQS FIRST thread right there near the top of the forum? The sticky thread is there, and the template POPLA appeal points are there to be read in post #3 of it.

discontent64

Thanks Coupon-mad.
We have been working hard to edit the template and make sure we have as many facts in the appeals letter for the supposed overstay.
It is an 11 page letter. Can anyone advise us on how best to post a link to a word document rather than have 11 pages pasted, or is it best to paste the contents?
Many thanks in advance.

Northlakes

Include pictures and convert it to a pdf document. Adobe has a free trial you can use.
Alternatively you can convert it to Open Office and I think that has an attached pdf converter.

Upload the pdf to the POLA website.

Best of luck with your appeal

Redx

Parking Eye nearly always monitor TIME ON SITE , not parking time , as their cameras are at the in/out point

hence why there are 2 grace periods in the BPA CoP which cover entry time and exit time added to "parking time" , say 5 to 10 minutes before and over 10 minutes to leave

this incorrect reg issue happens many times over

but as mentioned above , you use both popla codes to appeal to POPLA

and the LAND REGISTRY can tell you the landholder details , for a small fee

discontent64

Thanks for these comments - we were informed by the local Councillor (linked to Preston) that the incorrect reg invoice was one we should get overturned more easily - the slight overstay needs to rely on the points we have expanded from the fantastic template letter that a forumite has guided us to use as a starting point. It was suggested that we share the appeal letter we are aiming to send to POPLA on this site first to get constructive comments to ensure that the appeal is as strong as it can be before submitting to POPLA.
There are some parking companies who seem to work to the Codes of Practice, but fortunately, the template letter really allows us to go to town on this parking company who sent us the PCNs as they ignore most of the guidance. So, with the help of several people, we are feeling more confident that we should be able to get the penalties quashed through POPLA.
WRT the landowner, we probably have little time remaining to lobby them as the appeal has to be submitted within a short time. The onus is on the parking company to prove they have the rights to manage the parking. As the template suggests, simply asserting that they have permission is not the same as providing the proof needed by the appeals or Court (if it gets to that stage) processes. The guidance in the template has been very helpful. Thank you all.

It would be great to get feedback on the letter, hence, if someone could suggest how we load this onto this MSE forum without causing the system to crash from 11 pages, that would be very good.

Thanks.

Redx

files can be hosted on hosting sites and linked with a dead url (hxxp instead of http)

pictures and scans can be hosted on tinypic or photobucket , again use a dead url to link it

your popla appeal can be copied into notepad , then copied and pasted from notepad onto here , minus personal info and references , for critique by regulars

it wont come to 11 or 12 pages either , not the text parts , possibly spread across 2 or 3 posts at most

I have been reading these forums for several years and have never come across any of the dozens of parking companies that abide by either of the 2 CoP`s !!

read parking pranksters december blog about PE and their top 100 sites to see ways they alter the system despite having a BPA CoP

discontent64

Will try all that tomorrow, thanks Redx.