White energy storage meter - howto!

Yirara

Hello,
I just received the key to my new flat in Edinburgh. I'll be moving up there at the end of next week. For various reasons this was the best flat I could rent. Not too happy about the storage heaters.

At this moment there's a pay as you go meter in the flat. I can exchange it with whatever I like - and I will certainly do that!

What's the best way of using this heating system considering:
- I'll be away during daytime and only in during evenings and (parts of) weekends.
- the completely unheated flat felt comfortably warm during viewing (close to freezing) and when picking up the key yesterday (mild temperatures). I might not need much heating at all (energy rating is 1 point shy of
- but of course I do need warm water every now and then. I suppose the electric shower uses hot water from the boiler? Does it? Then there would be a water hose across the hall to the bathroom. How does such thing really work?

How do I find the best electricity provider for my specific need? Should I stay on cheaper night rate or use a uniform rate considering the washing machine (probably 1x per week), lighting, computer, fridge and cooking will be using electricity before offpeak rates kick in.
Do energy companies provide useful advise?

jbuchanangb

The presence of storage heaters means that the place will probably be on an Economy 7 tariff.

Of greatest importance is that when you move in you contact the energy company which currently the supplies the place, provide meter readings. Tell them you are now in charge of paying for the energy. There may be some debt from previous occupier programmed into the prepayment meter. Make sure this gets cancelled, and not dumped on you.

You say you can get the meter changed to a credit meter, i.e. one where readings are taken monthly or quarterly and then you pay based on the readings. If the existing supplier will do this for you, then get it done.
I have heard that some require deposit money, and run credit reference checks to allow this.

Storage heaters work by heating up during the night, and giving out heat during the day. They have two controls. One is for how much to heat up during the night, and the other controls the rate at which heat is given out during the day. You will need to use the second one of these, by closing it down in the morning when you go out, and opening it up in the afternoon when you get home.

You mentioned a boiler. How is this powered. Electric showers sometimes rely on hot water from a storage tank and sometimes heat up water instantaneously. Or if there is a boiler somewhere, then that could be heating water in a storage tank, or heating water on-demand when hot water taps or shower are turned on. If there is a storage tank but no boiler, it will have an electric immersion heater in it.

As to how to choose the best deal? Until you have sorted out the meter, you need to stay with the existing supplier, but when they change you to a credit meter, make sure you get a good deal from them. Depends who they are, but if you can get a 12 or 18 month deal without any early exit penalties it would be a good start. When you are near the end of that deal, you will have enough information to do a proper comparison.

Yirara

Ok, thanks a lot. Phew.. Credit check might be a problem I think: I never used my credit card and am only in the UK for just over a year. Ok, will have to see what's possible. At least the flat owner doesn't mind if I change meters. And I do have substantial savings to proof that I can live independently if needed, and a work contract.

Ok, the water tank reads:
T&D Trident
Eco-7 direct unvented hot water cylinder 150l
operating pressure: 3 bar
immersion heater 3kw
supply voltage 240V 50Hz
This one will be exchanged after the winter by a more modern model (edit: and the storage heaters as well). I guess it might be from the 90s, when the building was built.

The heater in the living room just reads: Heatstore

The electric shower thingy in the bathroom seems to be a Mira Advance ATL based on inventory photo and online search. Ok, I read that "For use with mains cold water supply." on a shop website. Thus the water cylinder only seems to be there for the heaters (and maybe kitchen water. Need to check when I move it)

There's no debt on the electricity as per inventory and a credit of 9.95 pounds, currently a ScotishPower meter. I checked the meter cupboard and 9.8x credit was present.

Considering this, what would be the best heating and type of electricity strategy? I never heat the bedroom as I prefer to sleep in a cool room. The living room felt warm even unheated. Kitchen has no heater but a door to the living room, and hall would not need heating even though there is a heater there.

jbuchanangb

Just because it says Scottish Power on the meter doesn't mean Scottish Power is the current supplier, so double check with the landlord about the supplier.

Sounds like there is no boiler only a storage tank. That is for hot water for the taps, but not for the shower which heats up the water as it needs it.

The hot water storage tank is nothing to do with the heating. The heaters contain bricks which get heated up in the night, and give out heat in the day as I described.

For storage heaters you have to be on the Economy 7 system. That means there are two readings in your meter, one for daytime and one for 7 hours at night. Make sure you know which is which when you read them.

You could try turning all the storage heaters off except the one in the living room, then control that as needed.

For hot water, it rather depends on your usage requirements. If you take baths, you will need a tank of water before a bath. If just take showers, then you won't need a tank of water. If you have other appliances which expect hot water e.g. washing machine (most modern ones are cold-fill only) then you have to think about heating water for them.

Best of luck!

Yirara

Thanks a lot. Then I have a lot more to research, especially with regards to the heaters and the best type of rate.

The washing machine is indeed a cold water type, thus doesn't need the tank full of warm water. The shower as I found out doesn't need it either. Only leaves the taps for warm water then. Makes it almost useless to run day by day in the first place. If I really wanted to then water for 2-3 rounds of dishes per week could come from the shower, and at the moment I wash myself with cold water anyway as I'm usually done completely once the warm water finally arrives.

I wonder if there's a way to find out how much energy such immersion heater needs to keep the water temperature at a certain level.

footyguy

Yirara wrote: »

Hello,
I just received the key to my new flat in Edinburgh. I'll be moving up there at the end of next week. For various reasons this was the best flat I could rent. Not too happy about the storage heaters.

At this moment there's a pay as you go meter in the flat. I can exchange it with whatever I like - and I will certainly do that!

What's the best way of using this heating system considering:
- I'll be away during daytime and only in during evenings and (parts of) weekends.
- the completely unheated flat felt comfortably warm during viewing (close to freezing) and when picking up the key yesterday (mild temperatures). I might not need much heating at all (energy rating is 1 point shy of
- but of course I do need warm water every now and then. I suppose the electric shower uses hot water from the boiler? Does it? Then there would be a water hose across the hall to the bathroom. How does such thing really work?

How do I find the best electricity provider for my specific need? Should I stay on cheaper night rate or use a uniform rate considering the washing machine (probably 1x per week), lighting, computer, fridge and cooking will be using electricity before offpeak rates kick in.
Do energy companies provide useful advise?

Are you sure about that?

Whilst it may well be the landlord has no objection to you changing the PPM to a credit meter, I'm not sure that will extend to any meter at all.

You see, from the thread title, you appear to be on a legacy tariff. Only SP are obligated to support the specific tariff you are currently on.
The appliances in the building probably are suited to that particular legacy tariff - if they bo longer are (as you can bet they once were) then the landlord should pay for a suitable meter. Some re-wiring may also be required (if that was not done when the appliances weere changed)

Attempts to switch supplier with your current metering invariably end in tears.(may not be yours initially, but when the landlord finds out, they probably will be)

Yirara

It's mentioned in the rental contract that I can change the meter to whatever meter I like. I asked the landlord (big rental organisation) why it's payg, and the rep hinted at the previous tenant not paying the bills in time.

jbuchanangb

I stand by my previous statement:

As to how to choose the best deal? Until you have sorted out the meter, you need to stay with the existing supplier, but when they change you to a credit meter, make sure you get a good deal from them. Depends who they are, but if you can get a 12 or 18 month deal without any early exit penalties it would be a good start. When you are near the end of that deal, you will have enough information to do a proper comparison.

Yirara

jbuchanangb wrote: »

I stand by my previous statement:

Yep, will have to do that. Email with regards to provider has been sent to the landlord.

Richie-from-the-Boro

Shower is on demand only uses what it uses. 6kW uses 30% less than 9kW, but a 6kW might be a cold shower in a cold winter.

Water cylinder should have x2 heating elements one at the top and one at the bottom. If it has x2 elements its almost certainly a PartL spec and double the ordinary insulation value which looses very little heat and hardly worth switching off. The water like the living room heat is cheap because it's night delivered. There's no such thing as waste heat - any heat lost from the insulation goes into your dwelling.

Most rental agreement's that allow a change of meter insist that its changed back to PPM at your cost if you vacate the property - check for this clause !

Best way to learn to use storage heating is to turn the input full and the output off altogether. Radiated heat is good convected heat warms no one but your upstairs neibour.

Best of luck.

Owain_Moneysaver

Yirara wrote: »

I wonder if there's a way to find out how much energy such immersion heater needs to keep the water temperature at a certain level.

The manufacturer's website would usually have this information but for a Eco 7 foam insulated cylinder typically 1.5 kWh per day standing losses.

So about 10p a day at Eco 7 off-peak rates. If you don't use the hot water it should stay warm for several days and the electricity use on subsequent nights will be reduced as only the standing losses have to be made up.

With most tariffs all the electrity you use during the off-peak times is charged at the off-peak rate, so if you can do your washing and have your shower after 11 pm or before 7 am you will save money (as long as your neighbours don't object to the noise).