Parking Ticket - Overstayed 6mins

presc

Hi,

I got a parking ticket today for overstaying on a private car park (ES Parking Enforcement LTD) for 6 mins. I tried to find someone I could talk to, but I only bumped in on a Civil Enforcement Officer from a local council. The person I talked to said that it was illegal for the parking company to give me a ticket for overstaying for 6mins, and that it needs "10mins observation" to issue a penalty.

The officer even made a note for me, including her registration number, so I can quote her when dealing with the parking company.

I was wondering if someone could help me figure out what would be the best approach to solve this - was the parking company right to issue me a ticket? Is referencing a local officer going to enforce my appeal? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Carthesis

Referencing a council CEO won't matter to them. They'll claim (correctly) that the observation period is limited to actual proper parking tickets from the council.

However, where you have got a leg to stand on is with "grace periods". These state that you should be allowed 10 mins on entry and 10 mins on exit.

Presumably this was a windscreen ticket?

Read the **NEWBIES** thread and follow the instructions there.

presc

Thank you for your response.
The ticket was a "Parking Charge Notice" stuck to the windscreen with some tape.

I will see the "newbies" thread.
Thanks once again.

Redx

also check the BPA CoP and the IPC CoP , neither state 10 minutes either side of a parking event , even though its what we believe and is deemed "reasonable"

check the exact wording , but 6 minutes to park , read and leave is not unreasonable , but only a judge can decide, if it gets that far

FOR CLARITY , HERE IS THE IPC COP SECTION ON GRACE PERIODS , NOTE THAT IT DOESNT MENTION 2 LOTS OF 10 MINUTE PERIODS

15. Grace Periods
15.1
Drivers should be allowed a sufficient amount of time to park and read any signs so they may make an informed decision as to whether or not to remain on the site.

Drivers must be allowed a minimum period of 10 minutes to leave a site after a pre- paid or permitted period of parking has expired.

The reference to 10 minutes in 15.2 above shall not apply where the period of pre-paid or permitted parking does not exceed 1 hour providing that the signage on the site makes it clear to the motorist, in a prominent font, that no grace period applies on that land.

I have highlighted the relevant part in red

if the time on site was legit , then the part in blue is also applicable

that council CEO is talking about council tickets and has no useful information on private tickets

the only thing worse than poor information is disinformation

its not "illegal" either , as illegality would mean its against the law , there is no law on this aspect so its not illegal, but breaks the applicable Code of Practice

Coupon-mad

But don't pay and don't panic. Hopefully the NEWBIES thread makes the 'don't pay' message clear.

presc

Hi,

Thanks for the tips everyone. I did a little bit of digging, as well as I read the NEWBIES thread but I still have a few questions.

First of all, the PPC 'm dealing with is registered with IPC. Secondly, I went back to the parking place, and took a picture of the signage (tried posting with image, but I can't do so as a new member). There is no indication that the grace period doesn't apply on the parking.

"Drivers should be allowed a sufficient amount of time to leave a site after a pre-paid or
permitted period of parking has expired." - this is from the IPC COP (15.2), so just like Redx has mentioned, 6 mins seems to me reasonable and/or "sufficient".


So the question now is how to proceed? Is there a point trying to give them a call and point out their agreement with IPC and its COP and mention that 6mins should count as "sufficient"?

If not, then I have a question about the NEWBIES thread.
It mentions: " if this is an IPC member parking firm, see post #3, there is no POPLA for you, so consumers do not get a fair appeal"
But post #3 just talks about POPLA, and for IPC there's no POPLA - I am missing something?

Also, the thread mentions:
"Instead, just send this letter or a version of it..."
Should I just write the letter to the PPC and not bother with calling them at all? Should the letter include my point of view and mention the IPC POC, or should I simply just follow the template? Lastly, do I need to wait 26 days before sending this letter or does this not apply to PPC partnered with IPC?


I hope that this all makes sense,
Many Thanks.

Carthesis

Don't phone them. EVER! IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCE! Far too easy to make a mistake and admit the driver at the simplest level.

Send them off the template letter. You may wish to amend it slightly to refer to the IPC COP in reference to the entry 'observation' period and the exit 'grace' period. Again, be careful to not indicate who was driving.

They'll likely ignore it anyway, but you can only try.

At that point, just remember to keep copies of EVERYTHING!

No phone calls. Everything is done by letter or email, so you have records of what was sent and said.

Coupon-mad

Post #3 of the NEWBIES thread doesn't just talk about POPLA.

So the question now is how to proceed?

No it's not. There is no next step except the advice already in the NEWBIES thread. One challenge then ignore.

Absolutely NEVER NEVER phone a parking firm or debt collector.

The officer even made a note for me, including her registration number, so I can quote her when dealing with the parking company.

Pointless. That's like getting a Policeman to quote what he would do in a security situation, then trying to tell a thick-necked club bouncer to follow the same rules. Chalk & cheese. Forget it, stop taking this so seriously. This is not a parking fine.

Guys_Dad

IPC Code of Practice. For once better than BPA CoP for a topic.

See here , page 15
http://www.theipc.info/uploads/vjnl0XFpge5CLwGPL3dN-KbdoEvOKUccAjn36Cbetwo/Amended%20Code%20of%20Practice%2001.10.2016.pdf

presc

When writing the letter to the PPC, should I mention the fact about the grace periods (IPC COP) or should I not? The way I see this is that this could indicate who was the driver at the time, otherwise how would I know what it says on their signs?

Same goes for sending the complain in writing in general. How would I know that the ticket was issued if I wasn't the driver, before getting the Notice to Keeper letter? Therefore, I'm not sure I understand the "wait 26 days" suggestion - doesn't sending the complain already indicate who was the driver?

I may be overthinking this, so I thought I will ask.
Thank you.

Grimble

Use the term "the driver did this that or the other".