Have your cake, repeated.

saverbuyer

joefizz wrote: »

'Supposing a Jew asked an Arab baker in edge ware road, London (lots of them there) to bake a cake in Israeli colours, map of the country, "don't forget to include the West Bank and Jerusalem now", would he not be within his rights to tell him to !!!! off?'

You can refuse anyones business without giving a reason at all.

One of the tenets of this case was that the order was originally accepted and paid for so creating a contract and was only rejected a couple of days later.
Thats a big difference in this case and under law. The contract was created and the contract was then rejected on the grounds of the message. They could have refused to accept on point of order for any number of legal reasons but they didnt.
They took the order, took the money then rejected it a couple of days later.

Actually not really. They would have to provide a reason for refusing provide a service they advertise. If the reason for refusal contravenes a protected right, it wouldn't be a defense.

You can't refuse to bake a cake with a pro !!!!!exual marriage message but accept an order for a heterosexual one.


I suppose they could just lie and say the icing machine is broken. But that wouldn't be very Christian.

qwert_yuiop

Well maybe they changed their mind. Unless that's illegal in the modern world as well?

BJV

Ok well I am not religious but respect peoples rights to be. He believes that as part of his religion he should not support gay marriage. ???

IMO a bit outdated but ok his choice. 100% set up in that there must be a million bakers able to bake the cake yet it just so happened ????

The court case???

Ok so lets take it further will it now mean that I have the right to force a halal butcher to get me some bacon?

Again IMO a waste of time and money. Shame that this type of behavior from both sides is still around.

joefizz

'Actually not really. They would have to provide a reason for refusing provide a service they advertise. If the reason for refusal contravenes a protected right, it wouldn't be a defense. '

Indeed. I contradicted myself in my previous post, there were a number of legal reasons they could have refused the order but once the order is accepted thats it.

joefizz

'Ok so lets take it further will it now mean that I have the right to force a halal butcher to get me some bacon?'

No. A butcher who provides and advertises a halal only service isnt obliged to supply anything else, just in the same way a cake decorator cant get you bacon either.
If its part of your normal advertised services then thats different.

qwert_yuiop

saverbuyer wrote: »

Actually not really. They would have to provide a reason for refusing provide a service they advertise. If the reason for refusal contravenes a protected right, it wouldn't be a defense.

You can't refuse to bake a cake with a pro !!!!!exual marriage message but accept an order for a heterosexual one.


I suppose they could just lie and say the icing machine is broken. But that wouldn't be very Christian.

In the above situation , he'd be telling him to hop it because he didn't like his politics, and fair enough, but seemingly probably likely to bring the whole machinery of the state and legal system down on him.

qwert_yuiop

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

In the above situation , he'd be telling him to hop it because he didn't like his politics, and fair enough, but seemingly probably likely to bring the whole machinery of the state and legal system down on him.

Sorry this refers to my own spiel ( nice Yiddish word there) about an Arab baker.

qwert_yuiop

joefizz wrote: »

'Ok so lets take it further will it now mean that I have the right to force a halal butcher to get me some bacon?'

No. A butcher who provides and advertises a halal only service isnt obliged to supply anything else, just in the same way a cake decorator cant get you bacon either.
If its part of your normal advertised services then thats different.

And deserving of a legal case? What guff. I don't know these people and I've no particular feelings on gay marriage, but I know who I'll be going to if I need a cake. I can't be the only one.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

I honestly didn't know Ashers was a "Christian bakery" (whatever that is) before this case kicked off. Did you?
I honestly couldn't tell you if he did picked "possibly the only bakery" with religious objections because I'm not aware of any other bakery that holds religious views.

Yes, you're right. He just hit it lucky didn't he? A leading gay activist happens to want a cake baked with a religiously controversial slogan on it (and his website logo just on the off chance something hit off and they could get free publicity) and happens to do so in probably the only shop in the country that might object?


Gee he was really "unlucky" wasn't he?


Alternatively, the right people new the right things and the right buttons to press to get a reaction - call me cynical of course.

saverbuyer wrote: »

If I want a bun I go into a place and buy a bun. If it's in the general direction I'm travelling, I'll choose there. No reason to believe Lee didn't do the same things. He has obviously stated under oath (possibly affirmation) that he didn't target the bakery. You don't think it's worth giving the benefit of the doubt to someone, who has stated in court, under oath, that he didn't target this bakery, then fine. I prefer to believe people don't go around perjuring themselves over a victorian sponge.

It wasn't over a Victorian sponge though was it? It was over what was on the cake, and the subsequent furore and publicity.


Next you'll be telling us you think our politicials are all really nice, balanced individuals.....

saverbuyer wrote: »

But he's a vocal gay activist who actively supports equal rights for gay people. He's obviously a liar. Those gays don't deserve equality. What with the constant lying and all.

He doesn't actively "support" gay rights - he ENFORCES them.


Big difference.


They picked on an easy target and they got the publicity they wanted.

motorguy

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

And deserving of a legal case? What guff. I don't know these people and I've no particular feelings on gay marriage, but I know who I'll be going to if I need a cake. I can't be the only one.

Funny, I saw some Ashers stuff for sale in a filling station in Portadown, and i'll probably buy some on the back of all this nonsense.