Have your cake, repeated.

qwert_yuiop

Is there not a better cause for the equalities commission to spend public funds on than forcing a baker to bake a cake with a slogan he doesn't approve of?

Sugarmummy

I don't think people realise the whole repercussions of this.....yes everyone should be treated equally that is true but where do you draw the line?? Nobody benefitted from this court case but the public purse is now down £80,000 odd because of a cake?? That money could have been spent elsewhere in our failing nhs, education systems, road networks to name a few. We are now turning into an easily offended nation where people are going to be complaining about everything (prob most of us already do). This only goes to open a whole floodgate of complaints and lawsuits not just against Christians but other organisations or people. We have to be mega careful now that we don't say the wrong thing or express an opinion that is different to others in case it is offensive to the other person and would leave ourselves in danger of being taken to court and sued. The law needs to be redefined otherwise this will spiral out of control. Freedom of speech really is now a freedom of speech in certain contexts but better keep quiet just in case.....

qwert_yuiop

Turn it the other way round - if an anti gay marriage activist ( I'm sure they exist, although I could think of better things to do with my time) demanded a poster (or a cake) with the slogan "stop gay marriage" from a gay baker, would there be a case if that was refused?
What a waste of money, although the MacArthur family got some publicity out of it. I'd never heard of them before all this.

spadoosh

This is one of my favourite videos on the internet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHMoDt3nSHs

ETA already a thread here

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5107205

Starts from the early days of it making the press/going to court.

saverbuyer

Sugarmummy wrote: »

I don't think people realise the whole repercussions of this.....yes everyone should be treated equally that is true but where do you draw the line?? Nobody benefitted from this court case but the public purse is now down £80,000 odd because of a cake?? That money could have been spent elsewhere in our failing nhs, education systems, road networks to name a few. We are now turning into an easily offended nation where people are going to be complaining about everything (prob most of us already do). This only goes to open a whole floodgate of complaints and lawsuits not just against Christians but other organisations or people. We have to be mega careful now that we don't say the wrong thing or express an opinion that is different to others in case it is offensive to the other person and would leave ourselves in danger of being taken to court and sued. The law needs to be redefined otherwise this will spiral out of control. Freedom of speech really is now a freedom of speech in certain contexts but better keep quiet just in case.....

I think you might be over reacting a bit. They are happy to bake a cake saying "support heterosexual marriage" they should be happy to bake one saying "support gay marriage" or simply stop customizing cakes. The man felt discriminated against and took a case. This has always been possible, nothing new here.

saverbuyer

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

Turn it the other way round - if an anti gay marriage activist ( I'm sure they exist, although I could think of better things to do with my time) demanded a poster (or a cake) with the slogan "stop gay marriage" from a gay baker, would there be a case if that was refused?
What a waste of money, although the MacArthur family got some publicity out of it. I'd never heard of them before all this.

If the same gay baker was making cakes saying "support gay marriage" then yes there would probably be grounds for a case. If they are happy to provide cakes with political messages they can't discriminate on grounds of sexual orientation.

Sugarmummy

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

Turn it the other way round - if an anti gay marriage activist ( I'm sure they exist, although I could think of better things to do with my time) demanded a poster (or a cake) with the slogan "stop gay marriage" from a gay baker, would there be a case if that was refused?
What a waste of money, although the MacArthur family got some publicity out of it. I'd never heard of them before all this.

That's my point....for equality to exist there would have to be and it would be very hard to prove that it was done/requested deliberately since the activist in this case knew ashers where Christian bakers and had frequented there on many occasions prior to asking for the slogan on the cake...so yes this has opened a whole new can of worms. So for example for those shops who wouldn't serve a soldier in uniform could potentially be prosecuted for discriminating against the soldier (tescos apparently did this a couple of years ago in England) so my point is that when some people believe that this definitely scored points against "bigoted Christians" don't realise that they could land themselves in similar situations and it will arise due to this case!

Also I'm aware that some people won't provide services to travellers for example....what's stopping them now making claims for discrimination???

qwert_yuiop

Sugarmummy wrote: »

Freedom of speech really is now a freedom of speech in certain contexts but better keep quiet just in case.....

You can only have an opinion if we agree with it. Smells like fascism to me.

Anyway, the real reason they couldn't bake a gay cake was they'd run out of mince. Let's see if that gets censored.

saverbuyer

Sugarmummy wrote: »

That's my point....for equality to exist there would have to be and it would be very hard to prove that it was done/requested deliberately since the activist in this case knew ashers where Christian bakers and had frequented there on many occasions prior to asking for the slogan on the cake...so yes this has opened a whole new can of worms. So for example for those shops who wouldn't serve a soldier in uniform could potentially be prosecuted for discriminating against the soldier (tescos apparently did this a couple of years ago in England) so my point is that when some people believe that this definitely scored points against "bigoted Christians" don't realise that they could land themselves in similar situations and it will arise due to this case!

Also I'm aware that some people won't provide services to travellers for example....what's stopping them now making claims for discrimination???

You realise the Tesco soldier story flying about on facebook was a myth. It didn't actually happen.

Tammykitty

Sugarmummy wrote: »

That's my point....for equality to exist there would have to be and it would be very hard to prove that it was done/requested deliberately since the activist in this case knew ashers where Christian bakers and had frequented there on many occasions prior to asking for the slogan on the cake...so yes this has opened a whole new can of worms. So for example for those shops who wouldn't serve a soldier in uniform could potentially be prosecuted for discriminating against the soldier (tescos apparently did this a couple of years ago in England) so my point is that when some people believe that this definitely scored points against "bigoted Christians" don't realise that they could land themselves in similar situations and it will arise due to this case!

Also I'm aware that some people won't provide services to travellers for example....what's stopping them now making claims for discrimination???

Nothing - but nothing was before either - a service provider cannot refuse to provide a service purely based on the nationality, race, gender, sexuality etc of the customer (Or in this case - the sexuality of the message)

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

I think you might be over reacting a bit. They are happy to bake a cake saying "support heterosexual marriage" they should be happy to bake one saying "support gay marriage" or simply stop customizing cakes. The man felt discriminated against and took a case. This has always been possible, nothing new here.

Its incredibly naïve to think that a gay rights activist group member just "happened" to ask a known Christian run cake shop to bake a cake with a slogan against their religious beliefs, and then was "offended" when they wouldn't.


It was a set up from the start.