Homes in the UK still very cheap/affordable

GreatApe

Windofchange wrote: »

I just don't believe the figures presented in that table. Have a read of the below:

dismiss the ONS and Land registry figures and post instead to articles in news rags and mortgage peddling websites?

Windofchange

GreatApe wrote: »

I do not dismiss anyone especially on this which is a simple topic of finding out a few pieces of data. You are the one that dismisses the Data I posted because it goes against your strong held belief and hope that things are crazy expensive

So once more, go look up the land registry house prices for the regions of the uk.
Look up the male and female full time non child non retired median wage
Do the simple math to show how much it would cost of their post tax income to service a 30 year repayment mortgage on say 85% LTV terms

Post up the data here for everyone to see
It would only take you half an hour to an hour tops

Instead of searching a billion webpages to find articles that agree with your confirmation bias, go to the base data do what I have just asked and report back

You will see quite clearly that 8 of the regions are down right cheap
The SE and outer London are affordable and inner London is expensive however inner London terraces are not purchased by dual incomes they are purchased by capital

Its not a conspiracy its not a bubble

Let the data kill your confirmation bias, you are so close

The stats I can find show around 1 in 5 people are childless today. So, you are asking me to come back with figures that represent around 20% of the population to show how affordable housing is for everyone? And you think that I am the one with confirmation bias?

So, to briefly play your game with regards to outer London being affordable, let's take my borough of Wandsworth. The ONS interactive map from 2015 shows the average salary at £27,029 per annum. The average house price is £802,576 - 29.69 times earnings in this borough.

https://landlordnews.co.uk/average-property-price-london-borough-following-brexit/

If you go to right move and do a search on property in Wandsworth, the cheapest one you can find that isn't shared ownership is £275,000 for a studio. This is 10.17 times the average salary for the borough.

So, to apply your request to my borough in London.

2 x £27,029 = £54,058 per annum
Gross earnings = £54,058 - £11,000 = £43,058 - £8611 income tax gives them £34,447 per annum to spend.

For them to buy the studio at 85% they would need a mortgage of£233,750. Using the calculator on this site they would pay £985 a month, or £11,820 a year or 34% of their take home.

This could be considered affordable, but how many couples are going to want to buy a studio?

So there you go. 20% of London (childless) can buy the cheapest studio comfortably. I think the only way we will ever agree is to meet back here in a years time. One of us will be wrong.

economic

Who cares about the average wage. It's irrelevant. How many times do we have to tell you???

ukcarper

economic wrote: »

Who cares about the average wage. It's irrelevant. How many times do we have to tell you???

It's is relevant to this thread as the OP is saying property is affordable to people on median wage.

ukcarper

Windofchange wrote: »

The stats I can find show around 1 in 5 people are childless today. So, you are asking me to come back with figures that represent around 20% of the population to show how affordable housing is for everyone? And you think that I am the one with confirmation bias?

So, to briefly play your game with regards to outer London being affordable, let's take my borough of Wandsworth. The ONS interactive map from 2015 shows the average salary at £27,029 per annum. The average house price is £802,576 - 29.69 times earnings in this borough.

https://landlordnews.co.uk/average-property-price-london-borough-following-brexit/

If you go to right move and do a search on property in Wandsworth, the cheapest one you can find that isn't shared ownership is £275,000 for a studio. This is 10.17 times the average salary for the borough.

So, to apply your request to my borough in London.

2 x £27,029 = £54,058 per annum
Gross earnings = £54,058 - £11,000 = £43,058 - £8611 income tax gives them £34,447 per annum to spend.

For them to buy the studio at 85% they would need a mortgage of£233,750. Using the calculator on this site they would pay £985 a month, or £11,820 a year or 34% of their take home.

This could be considered affordable, but how many couples are going to want to buy a studio?

So there you go. 20% of London (childless) can buy the cheapest studio comfortably. I think the only way we will ever agree is to meet back here in a years time. One of us will be wrong.

I think it's reasonable to use meadian full time earnings as I don't think it's reasonable to expect someone working part time to be able to buy a house. Perhaps using combined male and median full time is not so reasonable but it's far from uncommon now for both parents to work.

If you look st West Midlands a male earning meadian full times male earnings could get a £115k mortgage the average terrace house prices is £139k so with a 10% deposit he would need a £125k mortgage so his wife would not need to be earning much.

Andy_L

Windofchange wrote: »

You are right to say that the median is the halfway point in a set of data, it is, it is the middle number. However the figure it gives will not be the average. Therefore if you have figures that are skewed to the left or the right you will get a very different result.

The median, like the mean and the mode, is a type of average.

Andy_L

Windofchange wrote: »

I suspect that UK (and regional) wages are negatively skewed i.e. the median value will give a higher number than the mean. This is my point in relation to the original table and it's data.

Your suspician is wrong.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/distribution-of-median-and-mean-income-and-tax-by-age-range-and-gender-2010-to-2011#history

(oddly, despite the link it gives numbers up to 2015)

The NMW gives a floor, whilst there is no maximum limit

Andy_L

GreatApe wrote: »

no I didnt have a look as it was clear he didnt know what he was talking about, having looked now its no surprise to me I have said often that the median and mean is skewed down by children and part time workers who should not be included when talking about house prices, however I should now also say that it looks like it is also skewed down by the retired who earn less too

ONS use FTE wages so part timers have no impact

System

I've never understood why people link average house price to average salary. Why must these things be linked?

I suppose if there was 1 house per person it might work. The richest would get the best houses, the poorest would get the worst houses and the average person would get the average house, yay!

GreatApe

Windofchange wrote: »

The stats I can find show around 1 in 5 people are childless today. So, you are asking me to come back with figures that represent around 20% of the population to show how affordable housing is for everyone? And you think that I am the one with confirmation bias?

So, to briefly play your game with regards to outer London being affordable, let's take my borough of Wandsworth. The ONS interactive map from 2015 shows the average salary at £27,029 per annum. The average house price is £802,576 - 29.69 times earnings in this borough.

https://landlordnews.co.uk/average-property-price-london-borough-following-brexit/

If you go to right move and do a search on property in Wandsworth, the cheapest one you can find that isn't shared ownership is £275,000 for a studio. This is 10.17 times the average salary for the borough.

So, to apply your request to my borough in London.

2 x £27,029 = £54,058 per annum
Gross earnings = £54,058 - £11,000 = £43,058 - £8611 income tax gives them £34,447 per annum to spend.

For them to buy the studio at 85% they would need a mortgage of£233,750. Using the calculator on this site they would pay £985 a month, or £11,820 a year or 34% of their take home.

This could be considered affordable, but how many couples are going to want to buy a studio?

So there you go. 20% of London (childless) can buy the cheapest studio comfortably. I think the only way we will ever agree is to meet back here in a years time. One of us will be wrong.

So one of the more expensive London boroughs are unaffordable when you look at the wages of part time working children and pensioners. The power of ignorance and confirmation bias.

I total agree with you the more expensive boroughs are unaffordable by part time workers.
So now find the full time workers wage of working age adults 25-55 and compare it to a more middle of the road borough like say Walthamforest and see what you get