Planning ahead

cookie365

Hello, this is going to seem a bit morbid but I'm a bit confused about what's going to happen to my elderly mum's house when she dies, and if I can get things clear in my head now it might save a lot of stress dealing with it at the time, and maybe even give us a chance to plan ahead.


My mum and dad bought their house before land registration was mandatory, and it's still not registered. I don't think there are any complicated boundary questions and it's in a suburban homeowner dominated estate so I expect neighbouring property on all sides is registered. There are no rights of way or easements or anything similar that I know about. I believe it was bought as joint tenants, though I'm not sure if any solicitor has confirmed this in the last few years.


Before he died my dad transferred things like stocks to my mum, so on the basis of the joint tenancy his estate was less than the probate threshold. I understand my mum has put one of the death certificates with the deeds; I need to find out where they are!


I'm likely to be my mum's executor, and likely to the main beneficiary - I expect to inherit the house. I might possibly be sole beneficiary. I will sell the house rather than live in it.


I expect the house value will be somewhere at the top end of the current IHT threshold, a good chance it'll be above but if I understand right then most of my dad's IHT exemption should be available to transfer and that plus the new direct descendent addon exemption should cover the value of the estate. But I admit I really don't understand tax or IHT very well at all.


My questions are:

1. Is it worth registering the house now? Will it make things easier during probate, and maybe flag up anything unexpected? Or will it just cost more for no particular benefit? Of course I'd pay the fees as it's for my benefit.
2. I expect if I'm not the sole beneficiary I should have a separate executors bank account, but would there be any benefit in doing that if I'm sole beneficiary?
3. Should I transfer ownership of the house to me as executor, sell the house, then settle the proceeds back to myself as beneficiary, or would it be better to transfer ownership directly to me personally and then sell it as a personal asset?

Thank you

Yorkshireman99

It is a good move to plan ahead. I would strongly recommend that you get the house registered now. If there any problems doing so it will be much easier if she is able to answer any questions. A solicitor will have to do this as it is not a DIY job. The money spent can make later transactions much simpler. If you are the sole beneficiary you may not need an executor's bank account but there is a potential pitfall if you were to die before probate was complete. There is no benefit in transferring the house to yourself as executor and then selling it. A solicitor can do both at once.

cookie365

Thank you @Yorkshireman99 yes I'll get a solicitor to do it, if I DIY it and mess it up it doesn't bear thinking about

SevenOfNine

I did it for my Mother in 2008. First registration of the council house she had purchased with my dad in 1980, lived in it since 1955.

Assume the process must have changed because it really couldn't have been easier DiY. Only 2 forms, FR1 & DL. She did have all the paperwork right back to 1952 when the landowner sold the land to the local council, then the council to them in '80.

Will you be able to take a look at her conveyancing paperwork to see what she has? (Seem to remember putting dad's death cert & the Grant in as well.)

cookie365

Thanks @SevenOfNine she has the deeds from when the developer originally sold the house to the first owner, and the conveyance from that first owner to my mum and dad, there were no other owners.

Yorkshireman99

Be very cautious about trying to DIY it. You need to prepare an epitome of title and convince the Land Registry it is correct. Unless you know all the facts you can easily come unstuck and this could prejudice the eventual sale. Sevenofnine may have been very lucky. It really is not worth taking the risk for saving a few hundred pounds

Keep_pedalling

Its not morbid to plan ahead. One other thing to consider, if she has not already done so, is sorting out a lasting power of attorney.

FreeBear

cookie365 wrote: »

1. Is it worth registering the house now? Will it make things easier during probate, and maybe flag up anything unexpected? Or will it just cost more for no particular benefit? Of course I'd pay the fees as it's for my benefit.

Having inherited an unregistered property myself, there can be problems in the pipeline. In my case, it was one of "where the h*ll are the deeds". It took several months to track them down hidden in the vaults of a London based solicitor (and we are mile away from their nearest office). The first registration fee was quite a bit higher for being a compulsory registration as opposed to a voluntary one.

If there are any issues regarding title, with your mother still alive, it will be much easier to answer any questions.

If you can lay your hands on the deeds and all conveyancing documents, it is well worth getting the first registration done now if only to take advantage of the reduced Land Registry fee. It will also speed up any sale of the house much easier/quicker post-probate - I had to wait six months for the deeds & title to be processed. If the FR had been done before I inherited, the transfer of title would have been completed in weeks.

Brighty

If you are sole beneficiary, there is no need for an executors account, but with my parents, i ended up with a few small cheques, refunds from insurance and utility bills i think, that were payable to 'the executor of xxx' or 'the estate of xxx', so i had to open an executors account just to have somewhere to pay those in. Was very easy to set up, i just did it in my dads bank while i was in there sorting everything else out.

If you are selling the house, there is no need to transfer it to you as executor or personally at all, the change in ownership at land registy will be done by the conveyancing solicitor of whoever buys the house, so it will transfer from your mum, to the buyer

Brighty

SevenOfNine

Yorkshireman99 wrote: »

Be very cautious about trying to DIY it. You need to prepare an epitome of title and convince the Land Registry it is correct. Unless you know all the facts you can easily come unstuck and this could prejudice the eventual sale. Sevenofnine may have been very lucky. It really is not worth taking the risk for saving a few hundred pounds

No luck involved, if you have the time & are confident you have all the conveyancing paperwork (back far enough), all you need then is the ability to put paperwork in date order, number it & enter it on the appropriate form! It only 'looked' daunting, actually it was surprisingly easy.

Land Registry themselves were very helpful, ensuring that we had everything. You can of course, just present all the paperwork to a solicitor & pay him/her to sort it & fill in the forms. Personally, I'd look at what mum has got, look at the forms, check out the Gov website on first registrations, assemble it all then speak to Land Registry.

In our case, common sense was required, not a solicitor's bill. Can't recall offhand if it was Halifax or Nationwide who were 'storing' her deeds for a nominal fee of £1 left outstanding on her mortgage - but they charged us £50 to get them back & redeem the £1 mortgage.

Yorkshireman99

SevenOfNine wrote: »

No luck involved, if you have the time & are confident you have all the conveyancing paperwork (back far enough), all you need then is the ability to put paperwork in date order, number it & enter it on the appropriate form! It only 'looked' daunting, actually it was surprisingly easy.

Land Registry themselves were very helpful, ensuring that we had everything. You can of course, just present all the paperwork to a solicitor & pay him/her to sort it & fill in the forms. Personally, I'd look at what mum has got, look at the forms, check out the Gov website on first registrations, assemble it all then speak to Land Registry.

In our case, common sense was required, not a solicitor's bill. Can't recall offhand if it was Halifax or Nationwide who were 'storing' her deeds for a nominal fee of £1 left outstanding on her mortgage - but they charged us £50 to get them back & redeem the £1 mortgage.

Your experience was quite easy because all the paprwork was to hand. If there are any gaps or difficulties it really is not a job for a well meaning amateur. It is simply foolish to base advice on one individual's experience.