ESA/mental health/universal credit/self-employed confusion

kubed1

I'm currently in receipt of ESA (support group) because of a mental health condition. Four years ago, whilst still at work, I developed psychosis, took an axe to the streets, and was sectioned. My psychosis has been transient and comes in episodes. I haven't had a full-blown episode for a couple of years now, but whenever I get stressed it starts to creep back in and I suffer paranoid thoughts, stop eating and sleeping, and start withdrawing. It tends to happen when I go through stress of dealing with benefits, like when I had to reapply for my PIP (which was declined). I can usually get a grip on it by removing myself from the stress for a while. Now I've been asked to fill out another capability for work form for my ESA, and I'm worried about what happens if it gets declined.

It's difficult to fill the form out because the psychosis is transient and not a permanent state currently in, so I can't fill it out as if I'm currently psychotic. Also, I haven't had a major episode because I've not been in work and there hasn't been any major problem with my benefits, so I've been on an even keel. But I know the pressure of interviews and work would most likely put me back in a psychotic state. Is it worth saying this on the form? The capability for work questionnaire just seems to be based on what tasks you can do, such as can you read and walk, and the medical assessment seems to be based on things such as can you pick something up. So I'm worried that they'll consider me fit for work, and I'll end up in a dangerous position.

Two years ago, I was moved by the council into what they told me was emergency accommodation, and I would then need to apply for council housing, where I would be considered high priority. A few months after me moving here, they backtracked on this, and told me they considered me housed now. The thing is, the rent on the private accommodation they put me in is too high for me to pay even if I had a job. The only reason I've got a roof over my head is because I've been in receipt of housing benefit, which is dependent on me receiving ESA.

It seems my only options, if they refuse my ESA renewal, is a) move to JSA, and get a job that doesn't cover the rent and puts me at risk of becoming psychotic and being made homeless, or b ) refuse the jobs that they make me apply for, and thus get sanctioned and lose my housing benefit.

Is there any other financial route for me that anyone can think of?

I've spent the last year learning digital arts and animation skills, and I'm actually not bad at it. Really, I want to be able to work from home because that cuts out the stress I suffer from dealing with people. I thought it would be possible to be become self-employed and get some of my housing benefit paid until I was able to fully support myself. But it seems the switch to Universal Credit will stop me being able to do that? I will then be forced to look for work under the job centre's conditions, if I don't earn enough money from being self-employed to cover all my rent?

Any advice appreciated.

Alice_Holt

Re ESa:
Take a look at regulations 35 & 29. These provide that if a return to work / participation in the WRAG (Reg 35) would be a significant risk to your health then ESa can be awarded regardless of any points scored.
See: http://www.cpag.org.uk/content/making-exception

The Esa form hasn't got a box for this, so state it clearly at the start and in the Additional Info box at the end. Also worth contacting your GP / CPN and to see if they would write a letter citing "significant risk to mental health" if you had to sit in on WRAG interviews, training sesssions, voluntary work etc.
If you can't get this letter in time for the ESa form return date, then take a copy to your WCA.

You may score points on these descriptors:
(See - https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/med2/indexxx.php)

15.� Getting about.
16.� Coping with social engagement due to cognitive impairment or mental disorder.
17.� Appropriateness of behaviour with other people, due to cognitive impairment or mental disorder.

I think you could make a strong case for 15 points on 17b. What would happen if your were in a work environment and dealing with people? Include details of why you were sectioned on the form and what happens now when you feel stressed..

These may be useful in completing the ESa Form:
http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/employment-and-support-allowance/esa-claims
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/help-with-your-esa-claim/fill-in-form/

I think it would be worth trying PIP again with help from your local CAB.
Although more difficult than DLA for mental health, it can be done -
See - http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-claims

If successful then a standard award is c.£55 pw and you may be able to get a £62 premium on your ESa. See what your local CAB says, and have a look through the guide above.

Do remember that you have a right of appeal against flawed DWP decisions. So if the ESa decision goes against you, get help from your local CAB to appeal it. I'm assuming you are too late to appeal the PIP decision.

Good luck.

pmlindyloo

I suggest that you concentrate on one thing at a time to reduce your stress levels.

The first thing you need to do is complete your ESA form.

Is it possible to get some help with this from CAB or a welfare adviser? This would also alleviate some of the stress. If you have difficulty in making an appointment in time it may be worth telephoning and asking for an extension to the time that the form needs to be sent back. Make sure you ask them to put a note on your claim about this time extension and make a note of the person you speak to and day/time. (CAB may help you do this)

Are you on any medication or receiving any support as regards your mental health illness? It would be sensible to make an appointment with your doctor to discuss this and ask if he/she would write a supporting letter on the affect of working/interviews/ work related activities/signing on would have on your mental health.

There is another route to getting back into the support group and that is through 'Exceptional circumstances'. You can read about it here

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/534844/dmgch42.pdf

42310 onwards.

A welfare adviser/CAB benefits specialist could help you with putting forward this reasoning, and supporting evidence from your doctor/mental health care provider could add weight to the argument.

Just to reassure you - HB would still pay the same amount of HB if you were on JSA and if you found work you may still be eligible for some HB based on a low income.

As regards your housing situation it seems that the council have decided that having found you private accommodation then they have met their statutory obligation as regards your homeless application. Is your housing suitable for you?

If you were to find some kind of self employment then you may still be entitled to some financial help even if you were moved to Universal Credit, at least at the beginning of your self employment.

Are you aware that you can do some permitted Work whilst on ESA without it affecting any of your benefits? You would need to speak to someone at the Job Centre about this as you need their permission and there are criteria to be met - number of hours and amount earned. This might be a good way of starting some form of work.

kubed1

Thank you so much to both of you. I didn't know about any of the things you suggested. I didn't know you could do some work whilst on ESA. I'd been feeling really isolated and trapped so it's really helped to know I have some avenues to explore.

I did ask for an appointment to get a letter from the GP (who has said before that he would happily write me one) but the receptionist just kept saying no we don't do that, and refused to give me an appointment to see him. So I've had to make an appointment to see him regarding something else, just so I can ask him for the letter. The appointment is very close to when the form deadline is, though. So I'm glad to know I can possibly ask for an extension. I used to get the supporting letters from the community mental health team but I discharged myself from their care a couple of months ago.

I'll see if the CAB can help me, or if I can find a welfare rights advisor, as you suggested. In the previous borough I was in, they had a welfare advisor attached to the mental health team, but in the borough they moved me to they didn't, which is one of the reasons I discharged myself, seeing as the welfare rights support was the thing I felt I most needed. The CMT had said they were going to help me appeal the PIP decision and write me a letter, but then my key worker left and they didn't have a replacement, so they referred me to a disability rights group. I went to see the disability rights person and had to go through the PIP application form (which is very personal) in a hall in front of a queue of people. It was such a humiliating experience I just pulled out of the appeal. But that's ok. I can exist without the PIP. I just can't exist without food money or a roof. Well, not very well anyway.

The one thing I did score full marks on for PIP was not being able to interact properly with people. Which seems a pretty central thing to keeping a job. In my last job I had to take immense amounts off time sick, because I obviously couldn't deal with customers whilst psychotic (and when I wasn't psychotic, I was very stressed and anxious). Also, I'm on quite sedative anti-depressants which keep me spaced out for about 11 hours after taking them. Spaced out enough I can't leave the house, because I can't cross roads alone etc. I've got a Freedom Pass because I'm not allowed to drive on that medication. Again, But, again, I don't think they'd take the sedation into account as being incapable for work, because it's not a 24 hrs a day thing.

My housing is great (small bedsit/studio) apart from the rent. It's market rent for London, but as I'm unqualified and have always earned working-class wages, impossible for me to cover on the the kind of job that the job centre would make me apply for. Which is why I was trying to skill myself up, and make myself capable for supporting myself, in a way where I could work around the medication side effects, and not be in stressful situations with people.

I haven't been through all the links you sent me yet, but I will now. They look really useful. And, as you suggested, I'm going to fill the form in pronto.

Alice_Holt

On the ESa form:

12.� Awareness of everyday hazards (such as boiling water or sharp objects).

This could well apply because of the effects of the medication you descibe above.

Also would your anxiety cause problems with -
14. Coping with change

Do put as much relevant information on the form as possible. The space to write info is quite small, so attach more sheets if you need to. The Benefits & Work site has helpful info on completing an ESa 50 form on mental health grounds.

This WCA Handbook may be helpful - (pages 122- 135) - on the mental health descriptors:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/535065/wca-handbook-july-2016.pdf

For instance on activity 12 it says "This activity is intended to reflect the ability to recognise risks from common hazards that may be encountered by people with reduced awareness of danger through learning difficulties, or conditions affecting concentration, including detrimental effects of medication; or .... psychotic disorders as a result of a significant reduction in attention and concentration..."

On activity 17 (appropriateness of behaviour) it tells assessers that "This activity is intended to reflect difficulties in social behaviour which might for example, be encountered by people with psychotic illness .... It is intended to reflect the effects of episodic relapsing conditions such as some types of psychotic illness, as well as conditions resulting in consistently abnormal behaviour. "

Do make it clear on the form, the difficulties that you have (and have had). Give examples if possible (the WCA handbook may give you some suggestions).

Alice_Holt

When answering activity 16 (social engagement) have a think about:

"If you’re struggling to know how to give detailed evidence for this activity, try writing the
answers to these 4 questions:
1 What condition or medication causes you problems with this task?
2 Do you become distressed if you have to meet people or have problems relating to them
and, if so, does this only apply to new people or also to people you are familiar with?
3 Can you describe in detail the feelings or problems you experience if you have to engage
in social contact?
4 How much of the time are you affected in this way?


It is vital that you give detailed evidence rather than just ticking boxes....."

kubed1

Thanks, again.

You're right that those boxes for explanations are tiny.

No. 12 is definitely something affected by the medication. As are a lot of the others ,such as communicating, moving things, standing... I could tick the "it varies" box for those. What happened at the PIP assessment interview, though, is that she wanted to know exactly how many hours a day and how many days a week I was affected, and if it didn't tally up to over two thirds of the week then I didn't get the points. That's why I'm not sure they'll take into account the medication grogginess.

And the assessor for PIP didn't get the fact that the psychosis was a fluctuating state at all. It was a case of "how many hours have you had it this week?". They didn't take into account that some weeks it was a huge chunk of my time spent thinking I was being secretly filmed and my computer being hacked etc. I'm hoping the ESA assessment is more understanding of how it works. I'd forgotten it was possible to appeal if they turn you down, so it's good to know I can have another stab at it if it goes wrong.

I feel a lot better armed with the suggestions you've made for approaching filling it in though.

Alice_Holt

kubed1 wrote: »

And the assessor for PIP didn't get the fact that the psychosis was a fluctuating state at all. It was a case of "how many hours have you had it this week?". They didn't take into account that some weeks it was a huge chunk of my time spent thinking I was being secretly filmed and my computer being hacked etc.

In which case the assesser failed to carry out the assessment properly. They should be looking over 12 months and assessing if you can do that activity "reliably" for 50% of the time.
"It’s vital that, before you complete your form, you understand that just because you can carry out an activity, that doesn’t mean you are prevented from scoring points for being unable to do it. Guidance issued by the DWP states that you need to be able to complete an activity ‘reliably’ in order for it to apply. According to the guidance, ‘reliably’ means whether you can do so:
• Safely – in a fashion that is unlikely to cause harm to themselves or to another person.
• To a necessary and acceptable standard – given the nature of the activity.
• Repeatedly – as often as is reasonably required.
• In a timely manner – in a reasonable time period."


Once the ESa renewal is out of the way, it may well be worth trying again for PIP.


Re: Appealing the decision. Don't take an unfavourable DWP decision as final, the assessment process remains flawed. If you have to take it to a tribunal, you will find the Tribunal Service to be very thorough. They will carefully listen to you, examine the evidence, and come to a considered judgement. The panel members are well aware of the regulations and are far more expert than many ATOS / Maximus assessers.

BTW. Do copy and keep your ESa 50 form and evidence.

kubed1

I tried to explain to the assessor that I hadn't experienced much psychosis in the past week but that some weeks it's every day. So she said "Well take the last three weeks and give an average." Which, according, to your description of what they should be assessing, isn't a correct procedure.

That's really interesting that being able to perform an activity once doesn't mean you are considered to do it reliably. In the PIP interview I was asked to repeat the words cat and dog to the assessor, and then say them at the end of the session, and this was supposed to be the test for memory. I have terrible problems with my memory due to the medication and the way my brain works, and being able to remember something that simple once seemed like a rather inconclusive test of it. So I'm just hoping the medical assessment, if I'm called for one, isn't as inappropriate as the PIP one.

It's reassuring to know that the tribunal process sounds fairer than the initial assessment.

I really appreciate the time you've taken to be so thorough in helping me.