PARKING TICKET: I've been a fool. Any advice?

Stepfly

First off, this is my own damn fault, which makes this all the more aggravating (I do appreciate a lot of the discussion on these boards applies to people being unfairly targeted rather than victims of their own stupidity)

Anyway, I live in an apartment block with an underground car park. In the last twelve months or so the building owners (an impersonal, non-local megacorp) have mandated the use of parking permits.

Ok, fair enough. As a resident I have a permit BUT although I drive I don't own a car, so only use the permit very infrequently when a friend wants to stay, or I have borrowed a vehicle for a specific purpose. I don't think I've needed it for about 6 weeks.

I've had a very rough summer, and a particular bad last week so a friend came round to cheer me up (we went out for a drink...)

He arrived early, surprising me (you can probably guess what's coming). I let him in... and forgot to display the damn permit.

We get back to the car and my friend has been stung with a £100 ticket (£60 if paid before the end of the week). I'm absolutely gutted (on top of my previous lows). Never been caught out like this before, and it was just a moment's forgetfulness we can all suffer.

I was in the process of composing a begging appeal letter, explaining I was a resident, my current state of mind etc, but a cursory glance at other stories here suggests that given it's UKCPS LTD I might as well just save the postage as bother with that.

Glancing at the pages and pages of people's extended battles with these private companies my heart falls. It's my mate's car, yet I'm at fault... But neither of us are in the financial position to just swallow the ticket without substantial pain (plus, I *do* have a permit, which rankles me deeply, even though I'm the twit here)

Is there any (sensible) way to push against this, or is it just a (very costly) lesson not to be depressed and forgetful in future?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to comment.

catfunt

OK. No need for panic or doing anything hasty.

You need to advise your friend to come on this site. He is the one with the private parking notice.

Have a read of the NEWBIES thread.. and have a look on here for other tickets for "parked in own space". This is perfectly defendable.

Also check the terms of your lease. Have you lived there since before the parking permit system came in?

Don't get distracted by the offer of the discount for early payment.
Take a little time, read and learn about what is actually going on here and you'll be in a better position to defend this.

System

Check your house insurance for legal cover. If Megacorp are attempting to change terms of your lease then you should resist. Imposing restrictions that are not there in the original grant can have a material effect on the valuation of the property - and a loss to you.

So continuing to accept terms that were not in the grant of the lease means you are instrumental in agreeing the variation and causing your own loss.

You may see it as a simple parking ticket when it is a land grab as it diminishes your value and increases theirs.

Get a solicitor onto it.

Stepfly

Many thanks, Catfunt, IamEmanresu for the swift responses. Very much appreciated. I neglected to mention that I'm a private tenant.

I'm not at my home address right now, but I'll check the parking provisions in my tenancy agreement when I get home tomorrow. I'm certain that my agreement predates the official implementation of this policy, but whether there was something vaguer earlier in the tenancy language I'll have to see.

I appreciate what you say re. directing my friend here, but I do feel entirely responsible and have taken on the task of information gathering, which only seems fair. Plus, I think he'd take one look at the density of information here, legal ramifications, and hoops to jump through etc and just elect to pay the damn ticket. To be honest I feel a little daunted myself just going through the newbies section. There's a lot to process if you aren't used to this!

Possibly my search-fu is failing me but doing a forum trawl for "parked in own space" has yielded SO many unrelated hits I'm struggling to parse the info usefully. Is there a method of getting more granular results that a newb like me isn't seeing?

Is a best first approach to write to UKCPS LTD at their "appeals address" on behalf of my friend and say it is my space and the permit fell down/ was obscured and, anyway (should this be true!) my tenancy agreement predates the permit system and its enforcement and see what happens?

He's a good friend, and was there lending support in a difficult time, and I'd feel awful if he was dogged by legal letters/ extended legal hassles/ because of my moment's forgetfulness. The ticking clock element does bother me as well, irrational as that is.

I don't have a solicitor, and given my own financial situation I'm loathe to bring one in for what - at the moment - seems like such a trivial matter. Thanks.

Fruitcake

You should also direct your friend to the Sticky thread for NEWBIES and then send the IPC template letter he will find there. Copy and paste and send using whatever method is on the PCN. Do NOT reveal who was driving.
If by post then send it first class from a Post office and obtain a free proof of posting.


That's it, appeal done. The advice then is either to make an IAS appeal to their kangaroo court then ignore anything and everything he gets for the next six years unless he receives real court papers, or ignore anything and everything after the initial appeal for the next six years unless he gets real court papers.

None of this is your fault. The blame lies squarely with the idiots that employed a private parking scammer to scam genuine residents and their visitors.

Stepfly

Thanks a lot for the advice, Fruitcake. Very helpful.

The PPC letter says they only accept appeals by post, so a physical letter it is then, I guess.

The form letter says "giving the registered keeper's name and address". Presumably just after the signature?

I wonder if there is anything to be gained by amending the appeal letter to indicate that the "driver" was visiting someone in the building with a permit, and including a photocopy of the valid permit (which I already have)? Or is that more likely to undermine the form content?

Yes, it seems like there is little to be gained from an IAS appeal, and some firms are emboldened if you do so and they (inevitably) win.

UKCPS LTD don't seem to be on the list of particularly litigious firms, so ignoring hysterical letters is an option.

Thanks again for taking the time.

Umkomaas

I wonder if there is anything to be gained by amending the appeal letter to indicate that the "driver" was visiting someone in the building with a permit, and including a photocopy of the valid permit (which I already have)? Or is that more likely to undermine the form content?

It won't make any material difference, so I wouldn't bother. The initial appeal needs to arrive with UKCPS just before their deadline for appeal - don't rush this, timing can be beneficial.

UKCPS LTD don't seem to be on the list of particularly litigious firms, so ignoring hysterical letters is an option.

Depends on your definition of 'particularly litigious'.

While they're not in among the 'big boys' like ParkingEye, they're not shy in the 'court department', so don't fall asleep on this. Be alive to a Letter Before Claim (or similarly named) or real court papers, neither of which should be ignored. .

http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/UKCPS.html

They have 6 years to make a court claim, and no one can predict how they will behave between now and 2022

I understand you are trying to 'protect' your friend, but he really needs to be at least aware of what's happening (as stuff is going to be coming through his letterbox). Maybe you should tackle this jointly, moral support, two brains on the job, but ultimately it is his problem to resolve.

Half_way

Why do you suddenly need a permit?
This is anything but "fair enough" and you should object to any imposition of a permit scheme on the strongest grounds.

A third party (the property management co ) sub letting your space/property to a profit making business, such as a parking company is far from reasonable.

Stepfly

Cheers, Umkomaas.

I suppose I had it my head that trying to "prove" I was a resident and had a valid permit might be a way of getting them to back off, but I see that's naive. This is how they scam their money so have no incentive to do so.

I'll let my mate know the details of the appeal letter that needs to be sent. This was just my information gathering phase. I'm assuming there's no real need to adapt the standard form letter from the Newbs page for this particular occurrence.

The Newbies page says wait three weeks to send the appeal so it gets there just before their appeal deadline.

The prospect of court action does make me nervous – ditto for my friend, I'm sure - and, in fairness, there is signage and it's pretty clear - but your link shows they've issued 26,325 tickets this year and gone to court 64 times, so the odds are ok.

Other than keeping all correspondence is there anything else that is sensible to do to ensure the right outcome should it come to court?

Is there any value in writing to the landowners?

@Half_Way

No, you're right. I just never anticipated being in this situation as I had a permit and rarely use the car park so I let it slide. Which is my bad.

There doesn't seem to be ANY mention of parking rules or limitations in my tenancy agreement.

Anyway, thanks once more for the help.

Coupon-mad

I'll let my mate know the details of the appeal letter that needs to be sent. This was just my information gathering phase. I'm assuming there's no real need to adapt the standard form letter from the Newbs page for this particular occurrence. The Newbies page says wait three weeks to send the appeal so it gets there just before their appeal deadline.

Yes - but check the PCN just in case it's one which says you must appeal within 21 days (rather than 28) because I think maybe UKCPS only allow 21 days and only the driver to appeal at this point. So, your friend could just wait for the NTK to arrive in the post and THEN send the template appeal, always writing as the keeper (we assume he is not a company car driver and his name & address is in the V5).

Other than keeping all correspondence is there anything else that is sensible to do to ensure the right outcome should it come to court?

Yep - my strong advice is, DO NOT TRY IAS at all because you'll lose and then the PPC might use what they'll paint as an 'independent ADR decision' in court. A Judge would not know it's a kangaroo court and might be swayed a little by the IAS win for the parking firm. DO NOT hand the PPC that advantage so tell your friend that when he gets his rejection letter he STOPS and files letters safely instead (keep them, just in case).

Stick, don't twist, at IAS stage.

Ignore the begging letters after that. Don't ignore court papers or a solicitor's letter.

Oh, and get some photos of how bad the signs are, right NOW. Entrance lacking in signs? Any obscured signs? Any angles you can take a photo from which show the £100 to be illegible from a car/from a space/unlit at night if the car was parked in the dark? Collect evidence NOW. File it away.

Is there any value in writing to the landowners?

Certainly - ALWAYS COMPLAIN. It can work; often landowners have an allowance of certain number of 'charges' they can cancel. Your friend should hurry with that - sometimes there's a short (e.g. seven/10 day) window for free cancellation by the landowner if they support a resident!

Umkomaas

Cheers, Umkomaas.

Not a problem. Coupon-mad has summed up in many fewer words than I could muster to put you on the right track for this - trust her advice.