Forced prepay meter installations could be banned for the most vulnerable customers

Cardew

GingerBob wrote: »

You are joking, aren't you? I hope you are :rotfl:


If you're not, then all I can say is that we've apparently moved back to medieval times.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1677543/Water-supply-cut-to-a-trickle-if-you-dont-pay-bills.html

Well it was a proposal, but I am not sure it was adopted; albeit I have read that it has happened.

GingerBob_3

Cardew wrote: »

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1677543/Water-supply-cut-to-a-trickle-if-you-dont-pay-bills.html

Well it was a proposal, but I am not sure it was adopted; albeit I have read that it has happened.

Interesting. I've never heard anything about it, so I'm guessing it never came to pass.


Some classic "spin" here:


'Thames Water director Richard Aylard said non-payment of water bills across the UK costs paying customers an average of £11 a year. He added: 'We need to sort out the "can't pays" - who we can help - from the hardcore "won't pays".'


Of the £11 (which is probably a lie) how much is attributed to the so-called 'can't pays' as opposed to the 'won't pays'?

Cardew

GingerBob wrote: »

Interesting. I've never heard anything about it, so I'm guessing it never came to pass.


Some classic "spin" here:


'Thames Water director Richard Aylard said non-payment of water bills across the UK costs paying customers an average of £11 a year. He added: 'We need to sort out the "can't pays" - who we can help - from the hardcore "won't pays".'


Of the £11 (which is probably a lie) how much is attributed to the so-called 'can't pays' as opposed to the 'won't pays'?

We could be getting off subject talking about water. However the water companies are financed in a completely different way to gas/electricity companies.

Water companies are allowed to raise £xxx million in revenue by the Regulator and make £yy million profit. If they have a problem with non-paying customers, the Regulator allows them to raise more revenue and that cost is passed on to all customers.

In exactly the same way, gas/electricity customers now pay for 'social tariffs' and the additional costs to administer the pre-pay meter scheme.

jaydeeuk1

GingerBob wrote: »

A valid argument, but; the water companies can't fit pre-pay meters, and can't disconnect supply. How do they handle this situation?

They increase everyone else's bills.

[Deleted User]

The vulnerable customers on prepays are those who cannot get to the prepay meters easily or even get out to a Paypoint to top up but the new smart prepayment meters will overcome those problems with other easier ways to top up.

Cardew

sacsquacco wrote: »

The vulnerable customers on prepays are those who cannot get to the prepay meters easily or even get out to a Paypoint to top up but the new smart prepayment meters will overcome those problems with other easier ways to top up.

That is correct.

However this proposal is about customers on credit meters who get into debt. As you are aware, better than most, the normal procedure is to fit a PPM either with the customer's agreement, or by court order. The proposal is that this won't happen(court order) for the 'most vulnerable customers'. So they can't/won't pay their bills for a credit meter and won't be made to have a PPM.

teddysmum

The problem for those of us whose bills will cover any loss, is the definition of vulnerable.


There are some very obvious cases but there is a very grey area where some could take advantage by playing along; likely those who work the benefit system, too.


You don't mind helping those in genuine need , but this could be an extra perk for the spongers.

[Deleted User]

Cardew wrote: »

That is correct.

However this proposal is about customers on credit meters who get into debt. As you are aware, better than most, the normal procedure is to fit a PPM either with the customer's agreement, or by court order. The proposal is that this won't happen(court order) for the 'most vulnerable customers'. So they can't/won't pay their bills for a credit meter and won't be made to have a PPM.

Yes I realise that but a smart prepayment meter is nt the same thing as an old key/card meter. It is a credit meter with a facility for advance payment like a mobile phone is by debit card or online. A vulnerable customer does not have to go to a shop or get down to the meter under the stairs etc.
I dont even think that a prepayment meter user can actually refuse to have a new smart meter in prepay mode.BG are now fitting these and from what I have gathered there are no refusals allowed even for vulnerable customers.

Cardew

sacsquacco wrote: »

Yes I realise that but a smart prepayment meter is nt the same thing as an old key/card meter. It is a credit meter with a facility for advance payment like a mobile phone is by debit card or online. A vulnerable customer does not have to go to a shop or get down to the meter under the stairs etc.
I dont even think that a prepayment meter user can actually refuse to have a new smart meter in prepay mode.BG are now fitting these and from what I have gathered there are no refusals allowed even for vulnerable customers.

That is interesting about PPM customers not being able refuse a smart meter. However what will the company do if the customer does refuse? - and there will be some adopt that stance! Take them to court?

That said the article is about the 'most vulnerable' credit meter customers(not PPM customers) who have run up a debt and are not going to be forced to have a PPM, and cannot currently be forced to have a smart meter.

bxboards

Seems crazy to me. I may sound unsympathetic but it seems more than a few people don't do a days work in their lives, and never have money to pay their bills, but always seem to have money for Sky TV, expensive phone contracts, cigarettes, booze and lottery tickets...

It's far too easy to pull the 'vulnerable' card.