PCN in London Underground Station - Appealed, no response, now ZZPS letter

Herzlos

If it's based on a bylaw, nil. If it's a contract/breach, then it's always a possibility. You'd stand a pretty good chance at winning in court though, and wouldn't have to pay much more than they are chasing you for.

Peterben

Herzlos wrote: »

If it's based on a bylaw, nil. If it's a contract/breach, then it's always a possibility. You'd stand a pretty good chance at winning in court though, and wouldn't have to pay much more than they are chasing you for.

How can I find out if it's based on a bylaw? What does that mean exactly?

Herzlos

Sorry. Is the car park at the underground station covered by any transport bylaws? I honestly have no idea how you determine that.

Fruitcake

Peterben wrote: »

How can I find out if it's based on a bylaw? What does that mean exactly?

It will depend on who owns the car park. If it is the train operating company then it is almost certainly covered by Byelaws, and there should be signs in the car park stating this.

Was the word, byelaw mentioned on the PCN?

Either way, you should complain to the BPA that you didn't get a PoPLA code then await their (BPA) reply.

Anything from a debt collector can be ignored. If you get anything further from the parking scammer other than a PoPLA code you should complain again to the BPA with a copy of the letter, plus send a copy to the scammers to show them you have complained.

Peterben

Fruitcake wrote: »

It will depend on who owns the car park. If it is the train operating company then it is almost certainly covered by Byelaws, and there should be signs in the car park stating this.

Was the word, byelaw mentioned on the PCN?

Either way, you should complain to the BPA that you didn't get a PoPLA code then await their (BPA) reply.

Anything from a debt collector can be ignored. If you get anything further from the parking scammer other than a PoPLA code you should complain again to the BPA with a copy of the letter, plus send a copy to the scammers to show them you have complained.

I've emailed the BPA, awaiting a response.

Looks like it's NCP owned; (search NCP arnos grove and check NCP's listing)

Haven't got the PCN in front of me though.

Really annoying though, as if NCP had said to me you can pay the £60 this morning, I probably would have gone for it to avoid the hassle. £160 is a bit different...

Fruitcake

Peterben wrote: »

I've emailed the BPA, awaiting a response.

Looks like it's NCP owned; (search NCP arnos grove and check NCP's listing)

Haven't got the PCN in front of me though.

Really annoying though, as if they'd have said to me you can pay the £60 this morning, I probably would have gone for it to avoid the hassle. £160 is a bit different...

You can find out the landowner by doing a Land Registry search. It costs a few quid I think.

Nobody here gives up their time and effort for free to advise people like you to pay anything.

Peterben

Just received a reply from the BPA;

Good afternoon,

Thank you for contacting the BPA.

The BPA is a membership association and not a regulator, and therefore has no legal authority over members. We are not set up to deal with disputes from the general public about parking or control, and the AOS Code of Practice does not provide a way for a driver to challenge how a landowner or operator has applied parking control or enforcement of private land.

We note you advise you did not receive a response to your appeal. This would be indicative that the appeal was either not received by the parking operator, or alternatively, their response to your appeal was not received by you. Unfortunately the matter of mail not being received falls outside of our remit. Recent figures supplied by Royal Mail suggest that approximately 7% of second class mail has been lost/undelivered last year alone. Therefore, I hope you can appreciate the position we are in for complaints of this nature. As it is not currently a requirement of the Code that the operator send mail recorded delivery, if they are able to provide the audit trail of the documents they advise have been sent, we cannot advise there to be a breach of the Code.

Please note that once a matter has been passed to Debt collection, the option to appeal is no longer available via POPLA. If the charge remains unpaid at debt recovery stage, it will be at the discretion of the parking operator as to whether they choose to pursue the matter through the legal system. As we are not a legal entity I cannot offer any advice in this area and would suggest you seek formal legal advice. Please note that the Code does not cover the matter of debt recovery.

The Approved Operator Scheme and its Code of Practice was developed by the BPA to bring a degree of regularity to an industry without primary legislation. Regrettably as we are not a regulator, (currently there is none for the private parking industry) we are not empowered to assist you further at this time. You will therefore need to seek appropriate legal advice regarding your position.

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[FONT=&quot]Yours sincerely, [/FONT]

Any thoughts guys?

Thanks a lot to everyone who has helped out so far.

Carthesis

BPA showing their true colours there then.

First thing: send a letter to ZZPC telling them the debt is disputed and informing them that while the debt is disputed, they shouldn't contact you again or you'll do them for harassment. Tell them to refer it back to NCP. Very least, it might save you a bit of hassle, and means that should it ever get so far as court, you can demonstrate that any additional 'costs' ZZPC might claim are their own problem as you told them the situation and they continued to pursue.

Second thing: write to NCP, inform them that you sent an appeal letter to them (include a copy of the copy you should have kept), and then state in the covering letter that following this appeal, you have received no further communication from them relating to your appeal. Tell them you don't know why this is, as you haven't moved house etc. etc. Ask them if they will reconsider your appeal given the circumstances, and if it is rejected, that they send you a POPLA code. Basically, see if they'll reset the clock.

Keep copies of everything, so that if they do decide they're going to take you to court, you've got copy letters to demonstrate that you've tried to be reasonable, which will stand you in good stead at the very least. After all, if the BPA/NCP can't be held responsible for Royal Mail losing your letter when it's them that sent it, how can *YOU* be held responsible if they don't deliver it? You've got even less control in that situation than they have.

If possible, send correspondence by email, and follow it up with a letter.

Don't know if it'll work. Worst case, you're no worse off than you are now, but with the small warm feeling round your bum that you can now demonstrate you've been trying to resolve this issue reasonably. Best case, NCP reset the clock and you can go through the appeal and POPLA.

Others on here might have other thoughts?

Peterben

Ok emailed NCP as advised.

Will see if they reissue a PoPLA otherwise sod it. I'm £160 quid deep already, sounds like it won't be much more if they do take me to court.

Peterben

Hi all,

can anyone give me a useful email address for NCP?

I've contacted them using their online Contact Us form and their customer.services@ncp.co.uk.

Still not heard a reply.