E S Parking Enforcement LTD (ESPEL) PCN through the post

Mr.t_2

Its the case of justifying the costs/charges incurred.

A delivery driver stopping to ring the bell for the shutters, takes a couple of minutes max, can £100be justified for that?? Dont think so.

beamerguy

Mr.t wrote: »

Its the case of justifying the costs/charges incurred.

A delivery driver stopping to ring the bell for the shutters, takes a couple of minutes max, can £100be justified for that?? Dont think so.

You know that, we know that, everyone knows that but ..... for a scammer it's £££££'s

That is what you are involved in, a country wide scam allowed by government, what would you say to your MP ???

Mr.t_2

Quick update.

I ignored the PCN received by the ppc. I hhave now recieved a letter from Gladstones solicitors for the payment of the PCN.

I have received this letter from the solicitors, however no Notice to keeper was sent out to me.

Where do i stand? If no NTK was issued, only a PCN and i never informed them if whi the driver was, do I have a leg to stand on.

I also have photographic evidence of the signs ES Parking have hidden the parking signs which classes as predatory tactics.

Now that i have received a letter from the solicitors what would be my next step?

Coupon-mad

If no NTK was issued, only a PCN and i never informed them if whi the driver was, do I have a leg to stand on.

Yes of course. No NTK means no keeper liability and you can genuinely write back to Gladstones and tell them you have had no previous letters about this matter and demand copies. DO NOT say anything about the 'PCN' nor who was driving! You are the registered keeper who has had no letters, simple as that, so you cannot be held liable and the POFA2012 has not been complied with, certainly.

I also have photographic evidence of the signs ES Parking have hidden the parking signs which classes as predatory tactics.

Good evidence for court then. Gladstones often try court claims but they bungle them very often too!

Now that i have received a letter from the solicitors what would be my next step?

Search the forum for 'Gladstones letter' and read other people's examples of a reply.

Mr.t_2

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Yes of course. No NTK means no keeper liability and you can genuinely write back to Gladstones and tell them you have had no previous letters about this matter and demand copies. DO NOT say anything about the 'PCN' nor who was driving! You are the registered keeper who has had no letters, simple as that, so you cannot be held liable and the POFA2012 has not been complied with, certainly.


Good evidence for court then. Gladstones often try court claims but they bungle them very often too!

Search the forum for 'Gladstones letter' and read other people's examples of a reply.

Fantastic info as always coupon-mad.

I will draft up a letter tomorrow and post it out to Gladstones.

Also if/when do i spill the beans regarding the photographs I have? As i do not want to lay all my eggs out for them straight away.
I do believe I have a very strong case if it goes to court.

Coupon-mad

I think I would vaguely mention in your robust response that you have 'reason to believe' that the signs at the location are so woefully inadequate to form any contract, that a driver cannot be deemed bound by them.

It's fairer (and gives you the moral high ground) to openly state the basics of your case at this stage, looks better to a Judge later.

Mr.t_2

Quick update :

*1- I responded to gladstones mentioning no NTK was sent out to me and demanded copies of the letters and NTK as well as proof of postage that it was sent out to me. Gladstones response to that was "our client cannot be held responsible if you have postal issues" for which i was on the floor rolling with laughter!!

*2- In my response i also mentioned predatory tactics and that es parking enforcement didnt comply with regulations set by the IPC in regards to their signage, to which they have requested "be more speific".

*3- In the letter it also states i am being charged for stopping for 8 minutes in a no stopping zone, which is what the charge was for....yes they want £150 for 8 minutes!!

*4- I have not once claimed i was the driver, so in the gladstones letter they have "kindly" lol , requested my personal details such as full name and address and a signed statement of truth. If i do not respond to this "we will be persuing you as the presumed driver".

*5- It also states on the letter they have enclosed a copy of the sign on the site. But there is no copy of the sign enclosed with the letter!!

*6- It also states £150 is outstandimg and should be paid to gslcollections.cm

In response to their letter:

*1- I have drafted up a letter stating "in my previous letter dated ×××× i requested copies of the NTK sent out to me along with proof of postage, i am still awaiting the NTK by your client 114days on since the date of inccident. (114 days is well past IPC's regs to issue an NTK and i have quoted the the exact section in the letter).

*2- Should i at this stage supply my evidence to them regarding the hidden signage (predatory tactics)? I have photographs to show some of their signage on that road is facing the wrong way, it is a one way road, the signs are facing forward, so you can only read them from your rear view mirror, only good if you can read backwards. The signs cannot be read even if you are stood next to it, you would have to be facing the opposite way on the one way road to read the signs (I will be quoting from ipc's regs in regards to the signage and predatory tactics, they lure people into incurring charges as the signs cannot be seen).

*3- I have requested a breakdown of how damages of £150 were caused in 8 minutes and why a grace period has not been allowed, a sufficient time for the driver to read the hidden signs to make an informed decision wether to agree with the terms and conditions of the site and to remain on the site or not.

*4- I will not be commenting on my personal details in my response. However I will mention, "I the registered keeper of the vehicle cannot be held liable for the charge as no NTK was issued or delivered by your client."

*5- in your letter you have stated a copy of the sign on the site has been enclosed, however there was no copy of the sign enclosed with your letter.

*6- i will not be commentimg on the outstanding £150 as im not paying it.

Is there anything else i should include? Such as in light of the above mentioned and enclosed photographic evidence of hidden signs, lack of grace period to the driver of the vehicle and no NTK being issued to myself the registered keeper of the vehicle, I would reccomemd you refer this case back to your client and suggest they stop persuing this matter any futher.

As the photographs of my car were not taken by an ANPR, can i request how the photographs were taken in my letter to gladstones? And mention how es parking enforcement has used oredatory tactics on the past by taking photographs in an unmarked vehicle?

I have written this at 2am, apologise in advance for my spelling mistakes. Any help will be much appreciated in making.my case stronger. I do not want to include anything the letter which may work against me in court either...

Mr.t_2

Anyone care to guess where the No stopping/parkimg sign is??? I only found these upon visiting the site again to view the signs myself....


Another guess?

Coupon-mad

Oh, I can't see those links...

But you might want to cite the claim number here to rebut the idea that they can bypass the POFA Sch4 and presume who was driving. They cannot:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/10/excel-parking-youve-been-gladstoned.html

That's not case law though, it's just one decision in a case that looked fairly easy to argue, especially armed with a decent defence written by bargepole. That one would, IMHO, have been difficult to lose, as with almost every Excel/VCS/Gladstones case! They are making it like shooting fish in a barrel for Defendants right now.

HTH

Mr.t_2

The fact that no NTK was issued and over 114days later....would that count for anything? Or in my favour at all?

Is my response ive listed above doing me any favours? Should i include anything else in my letter?

Coupon-mad, im unsure what you mean by citing the claim number on the link?.....