Break clause during 6 mth AST - question

CDESPO

Hello folks - one further complication I'd appreciate opinions on.

As discussed earlier we have no written to the landlord asking for resolution and reminding him of his responsibilities under the Housing Act and penalties for breaching it. RESPONSE = He's dug his heels in and told the agent its their mess to sort out and he will claim any costs back from them that he gets fined with.

Next step was then to wait until end of tenancy, request my deposit and start a single party claim to the courts regarding the breach of deposit protection rules if no response.

Here's the complication. Whilst we are handing in our keys etc to meet our end of tenancy obligations this weekend, the Landlord is refusing to arrange a check out inventory as the Agent advised them that this would implicitly accept our position on the end of tenancy.

Equally I dont want to accept a check out one month after we have (in our advised opinion) ended the tenancy.

MY QUESTION - If they are in effect refusing to arrange the check out inventory can I still request the deposit back - because any ADR dispute resulting from that will not have an exit inventory as evidence.

My thoughts are that by going down this route they are practically forcing me down the court route by now formally retaining our deposit for the purpose of rent. It may be that I have to start the Letter Before Action process for the claim.

I did suggest to the agent that I don't really care WHERE I get my deposit money from, just that I want my deposit back as the house is in a significantly cleaner and more repaired condition than when we moved in.

If he is saying to them he will take them for damages against any fine he receives - if I was them I would pay me the deposit back as I have stated in writing that if I get my full deposit returned I won't go down the court route. Its a £2.5k downside for them or the risk of a potential £10k downside plus costs.

Miss_Samantha

Your landlord will have to agree to ADR. From what you wrote he will refuse and tell the scheme that the tenancy hasn't ended yet.

They are acting consistently with their position that the tenancy continues. It had to be expected.

CDESPO

Thanks - I just want to make sure that I do not weaken my position by agreeing to that. I guess I will just have to make sure I have a full written evidence trail of my check out obligations being met and my requests for the check out inventory to be conducted.

silvercar

If he is saying to them he will take them for damages against any fine he receives - if I was them I would pay me the deposit back as I have stated in writing that if I get my full deposit returned I won't go down the court route. Its a £2.5k downside for them or the risk of a potential £10k downside plus costs.

I wouldn't be interested in private squabbles between the landlord and his agent, they are nothing to do with you.

CDESPO

Thanks for all the help so far folks. A quick update and a request for advice

So we have moved out now - after much debate we managed to force the landlord via the agent to do the checkout on the 18th July - however they are still maintaining their position that we are liable for rent up until the 18th August.

In terms of the deposit return process - I went through the guidelines on Shelter and have sent a formal letter to the landlord the day after we officially moved out requesting return of the deposit within ten days. I had a response saying (paraphrasing - Its not their responsibility as they don't hold the deposit, we need to go through the agency. Also they haven't had the check out report back so no decisions can be made.

questions:

1- Is this correct that I have to go through the agency? The guidelines I have seen all indicate that it needs to be formally requested via landlord.

2 - Is the ten day timeframe just considered to be fair and reasonable or is that a legislated timeline. I can see them dragging this out beyond ten days by first holding back the report and then throwing out loads of unsupported deductions

3 - Whats the next step if I dont get a formal list of proposed deductions within the ten days?

G_M

1) what address were you given "for serving notices" on the landlord? The law says this has to be provided, and this is were you write.

It may well be c/o the agency, or it may be the LL's home, or indeed his mum - does not matter, that's where you write.

It is usually in the tenancy agreement, but may have been suppied seperately. It must however have been provided to you in writing.

2) fair and reasonable

3) either a single person claim to the scheme, or moneyclaim online. Sue the landlord and agent jointly.

CDESPO

G_M wrote: »

1) what address were you given "for serving notices" on the landlord? The law says this has to be provided, and this is were you write.

It may well be c/o the agency, or it may be the LL's home, or indeed his mum - does not matter, that's where you write.

It is usually in the tenancy agreement, but may have been suppied seperately. It must however have been provided to you in writing.

2) fair and reasonable

3) either a single person claim to the scheme, or moneyclaim online. Sue the landlord and agent jointly.

So reading the tenancy it says:

8.1 Service of notice

8.1.1 Any notice served by the tenant shall be deemed served on the Landlord at the following address using normal hand delivery when the notice will if served before 4.30pm be deemed served on the same working day or by first class post when the notice will be deemed served two working days later. a working day does not include a Saturday, Sunday or bank holiday.

Thats it. No reference to any address beyond that point.

G_M

CDESPO wrote: »

So reading the tenancy it says:

8.1 Service of notice

8.1.1 Any notice served by the tenant shall be deemed served on the Landlord at the following address using normal hand delivery when the notice will if served before 4.30pm be deemed served on the same working day or by first class post when the notice will be deemed served two working days later. a working day does not include a Saturday, Sunday or bank holiday.

Thats it. No reference to any address beyond that point.

Seems strange that it should say " at the following address" and then not give an address. Is there an address elsewhere in the Agreement. eg front page where it provides the LL's name? Or at the end next to the LL's signiture....?

If there really is no address, then you could have saved yourself a lot of money, since without it, you do not need to pay rent!

See Landlord and Tenant Act 1987 section 48. Too late now to stop paying rent.......

Poten

For 1, I'd sue the LL. He is the one with a sitting asset so he is the one you will enforce against. The only benefit to suing LA is that the penalty may be more severe.

G_M wrote: »

Sue the landlord and agent jointly.

Why? Surely this just causes squabbles over liability and confuses the whole matter.

Re: 2. 10 days is not mandatory unfortunately, but it is a requirement of the schemes so if your LL doesnt comply submit a complaint to them about your LL. They may bar him from using the schemes.

For 3, single claim process has deadlines that LL has to adhere to or you will 'win' by default and the deposit will be returned to you.

CDESPO

@G_M: Yes there is a landlord's address in the Tenancy agreement on the front page - but not one in the section on serving of notice. That's the address we've been using for communications.

So current plan is to wait the ten days and then if I have had no communication regarding either proposed deductions or the return of the deposit, I'll raise the single party claim to MyDeposits and in parallel send the Letter Before Action to the landlord regarding failure to protect the deposit/provide the Prescribed Information plus failure to return the deposit.