Parking Charge Notice in a Free Car Park (fail to display)

Wilcouk

Hey again, well they never replied to my e-mail, infact ive now received two letters demanding i pay £100 and i have 14 days from this letter or they will commence legal proceedings.... they sent me a confirmation email of receiving the email so its not like it didn't get to them.

Umkomaas

There are no viable appeal routes for an IPC operator. So it's either see what further comes through in the coming weeks or months, or you take the fight to them and tell them that you wish this to go the the small claims court so that a judge can adjudicate on the applicable law (but you are confident of your position) as its now only a judge can determine the outcome.

Unless you get closure now, you really hand the initiative to them and you will remain uncertain what might happen in the next six years (the time before any case is debarred by statute). I know what I'd be doing with this outfit.

I presume you sent the letter drafted by (now sadly missed from the forum) Coupon-mad?

DollyDee_2

Did Chorleywood Parish Council reply?

Wilcouk

I did indeed send the letter that Coupon-Mad drafted up and no response and Chorleywood Parish Council did not reply either, seems like they are both sticking their fingers and going "la la la la"

Wilcouk

So i received a letter from "Gladstones" today



What i find interesting, they havent replied to the email i sent them but the only way they would of got my step mothers name would be through the email i sent to them...

Dear Sirs

Re PCN

I am the registered keeper of VRN ****** and I wish to challenge the above PCN. It seems that the enforcement at this car park has recently changed yet the signs certainly failed to inform the driver. The car park is free so any requirement to display a 'ticket' is an unreasonable term which was never in any event, communicated by clear signage.

You have no cause of action against a registered keeper in any case because this land is under statutory control (being Coucil owned land) so the POFA 2012 cannot apply.

Further, I see that this Council have confused 'penalties' with 'parking charges' so appear to have no idea under which applicable law this so-called enforcement might fall. The minutes of a Council meeting show their belief that these are penalties, yet they are not operating proper statutory enforcement under the TMA: ''The Council would get £25 from each £60 penalty, but the main purpose of the exercise would be to deter commuters from using those areas.''

The confusion about trying to operate their car parks illegally, outwith the TMA is rife among Councils but it does mean you would have no cause of action should you attempt to pursue this matter by way of a small claim. I would refer you to the Government policy stated clearly by Robert Goodwill in 2014:

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php?topic=4512.0

Council car parks MUST NOT be run 'as if they are private land' as High Wycombe Council have already discovered to their significant cost. In this case, for the benefit of the Council who can cancel this mistaken PCN, the driver was not abusing the car park, was not a commuter, did not park for a long period and certainly was unaware of any new contractual terms, which in a Council car park are quite simply, unenforceable profiteering by a private firm who appears to have misled local Councillors. I suggest the PCN is cancelled immediately to mitigate any loss on your part.

A copy of this letter has been sent to the Head of Parking Enforcement at Chorleywood Parish Council as they seem to be unaware of their obligations to the public under the TMA2004 for statutory control of their car parks, which one would expect to be the remit of the County Council as the Enforcement Authority for this area. As you will no doubt be fully aware, ignorance of the law is no excuse.

yours faithfully,
Sue

what are my next steps for this? i don't think ive asked for photographic evidence yet... seems very harsh for a free car park and receiving a £150 fine for it.

pappa_golf

remove sue,s name and address from that letter , also remove the ticket number

Wilcouk

opps apologies, Done!

Half_way

Isn't there a slight issue with a local authority, all be it a parish council using PPCs on their land?

Coupon-mad

Half_way wrote: »

Isn't there a slight issue with a local authority, all be it a parish council using PPCs on their land?

Yes, a big issue, and this was covered in the appeal as shown by the OP (I remember this case now).

I think that Sue needs to respond robustly with a copy of her appeal and say what part of 'not relevant land' and Robert Goodwill's letter to Councils, did District Enforcement not understand? I would ask a load of questions relating to that issue. Ask if their client believes they are relying on the POFA in this case? If not, ask for the evidence of who the driver was and ask for all photos taken that day of the car and signs.

Do not add weak comments like ''seems very harsh for a free car park and receiving a £150 fine for it'' because it's not a fine - and don't talk about 'no loss' because that's as dead as a dodo.

nigelbb

It sounds like you are local so why not lobby the Parish Councillors in person? Ask them why the Council didn't reply to the original letter of complaint pointing out that they are operating ultra vires.