Hypothetical accident, where would fault lie.

spadoosh

After seeing krakens very strange thread it reminded me of a hypothetical situation ive always wondered about.

<This bit is true just for the reasoning why im asking, not important to read for the questions i dont think>

Had an accident quite a few years ago. Basically someone pulled out of a junction causing the car in front of me to slam on, they stalled it, thought theyd get going again quicker so didnt slow down that much, by the time i realised they werent moving i was too close and didnt consider the conditions (just finished sleeting) so slid into the back of them (made worse by the fact that i tried to avoid it and ended up ripping most of their rear bumper off by dragging it round where as a direct impact probably wouldve just left i slight dent.)

Anyway totally my fault and believe ive grown up and its made me the better driver i shouldve been (breaking distances are huge now!!)

<moving towards the hypothetical now>

In that case the person who started the ball rolling would be the guy who pulled out (not blaming them in any way, i shouldnt've hit the car) causing the guy in front of me to break. They would be completely unaware of anything.

So led me to think about other instances where similar can happen. Motorways where someone pulls out the other person reacts (swerves) loses control and crashes. The person who pulled out to cause the swerve doesnt notice and carries on their journey.

So in an instance like that (the motorway one not mine) ....

1) Is their blame on the driver who pulled out? (ie do they have to hit you or can they be responsible for you taking avoding action?)
2) How would you go about proving something like that? (solely reliant on witnesses or a dashcam?)
3) Do they get in trouble for the whole stopping at the scene of an accident thing?

Any help clearing up my pondering's?

dannyrst

Pretty sure whilst the other driver is to blame, any claim from insurance would be on your own. The only thing you could do is contact police about dangerous driving from the person who pulled out.

Silver-Surfer_2

1) Is their blame on the driver who pulled out? (ie do they have to hit you or can they be responsible for you taking avoding action?)

There can be, the road traffic act makes no mention of a motor vehicle needing to hit anything to be involved in the accident.

2) How would you go about proving something like that? (solely reliant on witnesses or a dashcam?)

With difficulty, but the same as any other incident it's down to the evidence obtained.

3) Do they get in trouble for the whole stopping at the scene of an accident thing?

The could do, same as in any other fail to stop.

Silver-Surfer_2

dannyrst wrote: »

Pretty sure whilst the other driver is to blame, any claim from insurance would be on your own. The only thing you could do is contact police about dangerous driving from the person who pulled out.

And get yourself prosecuted for careless.

It may not be dangerous on their behalf, what if the other driver had allowed them to pull out?

spadoosh

dannyrst wrote: »

Pretty sure whilst the other driver is to blame, any claim from insurance would be on your own. The only thing you could do is contact police about dangerous driving from the person who pulled out.

On that basis would/could you not expect to seek recompense in the courts (if you had evidence)?

Think its about time i started using vehicle cameras.

dannyrst

Silver-Surfer wrote: »

And get yourself prosecuted for careless.

It may not be dangerous on their behalf, what if the other driver had allowed them to pull out?

Why would you let someone pull out then swerve to avoid them?

dannyrst

spadoosh wrote: »

On that basis would/could you not expect to seek recompense in the courts (if you had evidence)?

Think its about time i started using vehicle cameras.

I'm no legal expert so can't comment on that, but I thought you'd have to claim on your own insurance and if you could pursue through courts, it would be after the claim is settled to cover costs?

Car_54

As above. The Road Traffic Act definition of a reportable accident depends upon "owing to the presence of a mechanically propelled vehicle on a road or other public place", so there is no need for that vehicle to be physically in contact with any other party.

The difficulty lies in proving it. Typically A does something which causes B and C to collide. While B and C are exchanging details, A is long gone.

londonTiger

in the land of hypothium

bod1467

Silver-Surfer wrote: »

And get yourself prosecuted for careless.

It may not be dangerous on their behalf, what if the other driver had allowed them to pull out?

Are you replying on the basis of what the OP said wasn't the subject of their question? (OP related a true tale, then asked a "what if" question regarding someone lane changing causing another car to swerve and crash).

I read danny's reply referring to the motorway scenario, not the true tale from the OP.

maddogb

yes if someone does pull out of a junction carelessly/dangerously they can be held liable but ofc evidence would be needed, in the case I have experience of it was a woman who swerved to miss a car doing so and hit my parked car, she immediately got some witnesses and the licence number of the offender.
It is a pain though even with my insurers legal dept chasing it was over a year before I got a settlement.