Is this enforceable?

lgfbrown

Timeline of events:

30/03/16: Buy Rover 25 from well known reputable garage, admittedly without documents confirming head gasket had been done. Mate who knows about engines said it was sound after test drive.

30/04/16: The 'incident' happens. No PCN on the windscreen.

06/05/16: The head gasket goes. Garage give me the money back. Old owner had not given V5C to myself (had lost it!), so technically she was still owner.

19/05/16: Buy new car. Garage present me with a postal PCN the old owner has brought in that she got (see attached). Garage help me with appeal as they see it as not worthy of a fine, for a car I don't even drive now.

20/05/16: Appeal is, of course, rejected. (see attached)

My issue is that the old owner will continue to receive letters, and I have read elsewhere that these 'fines' basically get forgotten about and I am unsure what to do next. I wish to pursue this appeal because it is very petty - I am causing no blockage, cars can easily get around me with no issue and the car to the right was parked slightly to the right when I arrived, so that explains the parking with the wheel. I was under the impression the white line still counted as the bay, especially with the space next to it being fine to get through. I have got landed with this weeks after for a car I don't now own and has been scrapped.


They are saying I was not parked within a marked bay, even though I am in the bay. (Have JPEGs but can't attach onto here?)

What do I do? Obviously I don't want to pay this but is it better to pay than avoid potential hassle or does it go away eventually? Should I contact my old owner as I have her address?


Reply to appeal:
Dear Mr Brown,
Re: Parking Charge Notice Number 21046 (Vehicle: PF03XWK)
Site: Sykes Street Car Park
Issue date: 04/05/2016

Thank you for your appeal received on 19/05/2016 regarding the above detailed Parking Charge Notice.
We have reviewed the case and considered the comments that you have made. This appeal has been
considered in conjunction with the evidence gathered by the parking attendant, retrospective evidence
you may of supplied could not be used in the appeal decision. You were issued with a Parking Charge
Notice for:
Not parked fully within the confines of a marked bay and therefore agreeing to pay consideration in the
form of a Parking Charge Notice. The signs clearly stay on site you must be fully parked within the
confines of the marked bay. The signs clearly state that if you remain on site and do not adhere to the
terms and conditions you agree to pay a consideration Parking Charge Notice of £100.
We are therefore unable to cancel the Parking Charge Notice as it was issued correctly.we have now
extended the amount of time you have to pay by 21 days, please now make payment of £60 to reach us
by 03/06/2016 or £100 to reach us by 10/06/2016.
You now have two options:
1. You can pay the total amount due as shown above within the next 21 days.
Online: (ADDRESS REMOVED DUE TO FORUM CONSTRAINTS) Phone: 01616672215
By Post: Send cash/cheque/postal order to- Parking Awareness Services, 23 King Street, Blackpool,
Lancashire, FY1 3EJ.
2. If you believe this decision is incorrect, you are entitled to appeal to the Independent Appeals Service
(IAS). In order to appeal the IAS will need your parking charge number, your vehicle registration and the
date the charge was originally issued. Appeals must be submitted to the IAS within 21 days of the date of
this letter. For further information please visit Please be advised that If you do decide to
appeal to IAS the option to pay the discounted amount will not longer be available and the full amount of
the PCN will be due, if your appeal is rejected by IAS.

Coupon-mad

Parking Awareness Services,

They are a sad little IPC firm and you are at IAS stage - so read about that in post #3 of the sticky advice thread near the top of the forum 'NEWBIES please read these FAQS first'.

Basically stop there and sit tight. IAS is not worth trying - in your shoes I would not have appealed. Sit tight, ignore the debt collector threatograms (covered in post #4 of the same FAQS sticky thread - and done to death already on this forum more times than we've had hot dinners).

Come back if you get a (rare) small claim or a solicitor threat of one. NOT every time you get a silly debt collector letter! Please!!

lgfbrown

so i should do nothing? or apply to popla? what about the fact the old owner of the car is the person who initially got this postal PCN? and now the garage has scrapped the car which now neither of us own?

Fruitcake

lgfbrown wrote: »

so i should do nothing? or apply to popla? what about the fact the old owner of the car is the person who initially got this postal PCN? and now the garage has scrapped the car which now neither of us own?

You can't appeal to PoPLA because thus is an IPC/IAS case, as already explained by C-M.

You have also been advised to do nothing by C-M who is one of the most knowledgeable people on the planet when it comes to private parking issues. I respectfully suggest therefore that you follow her advice.

Castle

Why wasn't the Garage's name on the V5 when you bought the car on 30/3?

Coupon-mad

lgfbrown wrote: »

so i should do nothing? or apply to popla?

It's already answered in the sticky thread, come on, please read what's here already before the questions start! You don't get POPLA offered by an IPC firm, you get IAS which is considered a kangaroo court. So you sit tight, yes. EVERYONE DOES.

None of the rest is relevant. I would not have appealed because PAS think you were the 'driver' now whereas before that, they only had the other person's name. You have assumed the risk which is noble of you but stop digging. Stop looking for a next step.

Ignore them unless they try a small claim, it is THAT SIMPLE.

lgfbrown

When I appealed, I identified myself as the keeper. But the previous owner will be the one getting letters, as I only 'owned' the car for a few weeks, by which time ownership had not been transferred. But ok. I'll just see what happens.

And I did read the thread. Just new to me all this, and had heard many PCNs were unenforceable.

Coupon-mad

No, you will get the letters now. But stop responding - it just feeds them.

lgfbrown

Coupon-mad, thanks for your help so far. I've taken your advice on ignoring for the last few months, and ignored various other letters.

I have today received the following letter regarding court action etc. I've uploaded a picture of the letter on flickr (all personal info removed), and some pics of the 'offence'. Can you take a look at this and see whether I am in the wrong here, and if so, how best to proceed?

I have also returned to the car park and can see that this company no longer manage and enforce it.

Here's the link: https://www.flickr.com/gp/144295908@N02/94594X

Thanks

Coupon-mad

As it is still just a computerised chain-letter from PAS themselves, it's safe to ignore.

Come back if you get a solicitor's letter or a claim from PAS or a company called MIL. In the meantime, as you will now be worrying about this for up to six years, there is ONE major next step:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5524754

DO THAT!

Let your MP and Mrs May hear about how this awful threat is affecting you and what you think about the rotten greedy 'parking industry'! Write your own or use the template provided by the BMPA.

Do not panic and don't even think about paying. Do not be a victim. Just fight back via your MP and the Government, now.

Show them the rubbish you have received and ask why the Government thinks it is OK for consumers to be 'credit clamped' with a threat of court for SIX YEARS by this rotten industry of money-grabbers and ex-clampers?

On that linked thread, HO87 has just posted pointing out the stranglehold Capita has over this issue (which is all about money). But suggesting that the only answer - if the Government dare - is for PPCs to be banned like clamping was, and for S56 of the POFA 2012 (that led to Schedule 4, keeper liability for these parasites) to be repealed.

I agree. This rotten industry were never worthy of having keeper's data from the DVLA but especially not the right to hold keepers to ransom for six years for an event that they may not even recall/may not have been driving and in any case, is always unfair and nothing more than a protection racket.

Umkomaas

Let your MP and Mrs May hear about how this awful threat is affecting you and what you think about the rotten greedy 'parking industry'! Write your own or use the template provided by the BMPA.

I'm increasingly coming to the view that unless newbies are prepared to complain and show us a copy of the letter/email of complaint they've sent to Theresa May/Oliver Heald/their MP, that we spend our limited time with those who are taking a more proactive part in this for themselves.

To send such a letter would take them far less time and effort than that which we expend on their problem.

The demands each day are increasing (and regular numbers are decreasing - where's Redx of late?), ranging from initial appeals, NtK PoFA compliance checks and explanations, debt collector letters, POPLA critiques, tenancy agreement analyses, CCJ set asides, dealing with LBCCCs, explaining the small claims court processes, advising on defences, critiquing defences ...... it goes on!