Anyone know about boilers?

purplepatch

My baxi combi boiler is behaving oddly. Most of the time it is ok, but I've noticed sometimes that it has trouble firing up, sounds like it is turning over again and again for minutes sometimes before it does eventually fire up. Anyone got any ideas what that could be... and how much to fix if so.....?

I'm guessing, or is that hoping, that it's nothing major, but clueless about who to call up as the Yellow Pages is full of boiler repairers/plumbers. I've found quite a few Corgi registered ones, but is there anything else I should bear in mind? Is it worth asking for a few repair quotes first - knowing the plumbers round here, they'll be booked up for ages and this is something I need to get fixed fairly pronto before we need the central heating.

Any advice gratefully received!

Canucklehead

Hi

Possible causes... Fan, air pressure switch or ignition lead from pilot to PCB.
Cheapest would be the ignition lead most expensive ,the fan.(in terms of parts cost) It could also be as simple as a partly blocked air tube to the pressure switch.
If you have the installation manual you will find these parts in the back .
Try and get a recommendation from someone at work or a neighbour,Yellow Pages have a bad rep. I'm sure there are good ones in there but it's like the Lottery!
HTH

Corgi Guy.

purplepatch

Well. I asked around and took advice, used a firm my parents had used before several times. And someone else recommended them too, so took the plunge, gave them a call to explain what was wrong and they said they would send someone round to take a look.

The bloke came round yesterday and looked at it for 2 minutes, didn't open it up or anything, said he could tell from the noise it was making that it was the fan that needed replacing. Told me that he would find out a price for me and ring next day.

Today I get a call from another guy, the one that owns the company, saying that my fan is in and they want to send someone to fit it tomorrow.

I say that we've had a rethink as it isn't broken at the moment, we're going to leave it until it does actually go as we aren't really in a financial position to spend money on something that isn't broken yet - I explained that I had expected it to be a case of the boiler just needing a bit of a clean. He says well in that case it's going to be £65 plus vat anyway for the initial visit!!! Given that it will cost £150 odd for the part, fitting and vat inclusive (and the callout charge waived apparently.... think he was making it up as he went along!), it obviously makes more sense for me to get it fitted.

I said incredulously, so you charge £65 plus vat for a 2 minute diagnosis visit?, he said, yes, fraid so, that's how we make our money. I pointed out that nobody had told me about this beforehand, but his attitude was basically sorry but Tough.

Can't be bothered to get too stressed about this, have enough on my plate with other stuff, and it probably is sensible to get it done before the cold weather, but are they allowed to do this?? It seems outrageous to me, but perhaps I'm being naive!

flashnazia

How someone can diagnose a problem without opening it is beyond belief.
Can you imagine a car mechanic doing that with a car?
Tell them they didn't notify you of the charge up front and the call out was a sham because he didn't bother to look at the boiler. Threaten to get trading standards involved.

On another note, why not ring up some independant plumber's merchants and get a second opinion on the firing up problem or even try http://www.howtomendit.com

purplepatch

I know it probably sounds dodgy, but even to my untrained ears I could hear that it made a very strange whining noise each time he flicked the on switch... he seemed very sure. There was a kind of simultaneous whirring noise, so it does seem plausible that it is the fan. And of course Canucklehead said it was possibly going to be that too.

I've just been googling re call out charges and seems plumbers, electricians et al can charge whatever they bloody like and don't have to tell you upfront. From the thing I read, the onus is on the consumer to ask what the call out charge is before they come.

I think it's one I've got to chalk up to experience, for the rip off southeast I don't think it sounds too bad a price as I found the part on the net and for that alone it is around the £100 mark. Just annoyed that I've been forced into having it done before I wanted to.

Snow_Dog

Weighing it up I think that they are a bit out of line not telling you about the up-front charges.

Ita a bit of a grey area really, if you called out a builder to price up some building work he wouldn't charge you £100 for turning up and going through what was needed. But then the plumbing trade is a law unto itself I think.

As for the price, https://www.onlineboilerspares.com who I have used a number of times list the Baxi fans as being mostly around the £100 mark so I dont think £150 is that bad a charge.

Also do you want the thing packing up on Christmas eve when all the heating engineers are tucking into their whisky and mince pies.

Given the description you have stated its a good chance the fan is at fault and if you have a duff fan (bearings on way out) chances are you aren't going to need to take off the covers to determine that one.

The whirring noise is likely to be the airflow/fan blades, the whining noise is probably bearings. If there is not enough airflow the boiler wont fire up, it sounds like the fan is getting there eventually.

Canucklehead

Good evening: It is standard practice for plumbers/heating engineers to charge a call-out...the price is what the market will bear. Customers rarely ask my OH, Corgi Guy, what his call-out charge is, ask to see his CORGI card or even ask for a ball park figure when he diagnoses the fault.
However, free quotations are the order of the day for boiler installations...my OH conducts a site visit, draws up plans, consults the client about his/her CH/DHW requirements and provides a detailed, written quotation within 24 hours....sometimes the client has the good manners to respond in the affirmative or negative while others remain silent...such is the nature of the building trades. And... he (and I) spend far too much time giving advice on this forum to fellow MSErs but helping folks out appeals to our good nature despite the slings and arrows occasionally winging our way;)

Canucklehead

Snow_Dog

I readily and wholeheartedly praise Canucklehead and OH for their advice on this forum. Its good to see someone who is ready to give up their time and knowledge in this way.

Wasn't slinging any arrows your way honest:beer: if it came across as that then

purplepatch

It was just a bit annoying that when I rang up initially, I said that the boiler was still working, just occasionally failing to fire up and that I was after advice. That person said he'd send someone out to have a look - at that point I would've thought they'd have said that it would cost £65. Just my opinion I guess, but seems a bit like they were misleading me. I do think sometimes that when they are talking to a female that they treat you a bit differently- I wanted my DH to give them a call, but he just said forget it and get it fixed, no point getting in a stew about it.

Anyway, thanks for the advice everyone, it's appreciated. When canucklehead said the most expensive option would be the fan, I thought to myself Well, it's bound to be the fan then..... and like you say snow dog, knowing our usual luck, it will be on a weekend, or over the christmas period, that it will go. And my two little ones will be freezing. Got to think of them.

We've just had such a crap year of everything failing, from washing machine to power shower, this is just the icing on the cake and I could have done with waiting a bit longer. Heyho. Such is life.

Snow_Dog

Its always the way, we've just stripped out our en-suite because i've discovered leaks in the shower and it looks like the grout used wasnt waterproof as well as old leaks that have created a nasty mess of the floor below the shower etc.

Only, the shower that has probably been in since the house was built in 1992 in the main bathroom, the motor packed up last week.

These things are sent to try us. At least with this one you've got forewarning of an impending failure.

purplepatch

Aarrgghh. Latest is that after having the fan replaced the problem is still there.

So annoyed. We haven't paid the bill yet for the fan (turned out to be £160 plus vat in the end) and I rang consumer direct for advice today. They said that under the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982, the boiler people are obliged to come back and fix it free of charge as they have failed to deliver. Wonder what happens if it turns out that it only needed a clean and we've had a new fan fitted for nothing. Consumer Direct mentioned something about asking them to put our old fan back in, but can't see them still having it after 3 weeks.

I'm going to get dh to ring them to discuss as I got the impression that they (boiler firm) were treating me like a dumb female. I bet they'll insist that they need to charge us for any further work so this could be interesting. They're bound to say that the fan needed replacing as it was so noisy.... fair enough, but it wasn't causing the problem and it might have lasted another couple of years... it's always been a noisy boiler and we've lived here 5 years.

I hate situations like this :mad: