Economy 7, worthwhile?

Bamber19

I've recently bought a flat and moved in a couple of weeks ago. Flat is all electric, has an economy 7 dual meter and there are storage heaters throughout. I've not yet signed up to any electricity company nor have I been able to track my usage as the meter appears to be busted given it has the same readings today as it did when I moved in a couple of weeks back and this is obviously something that needs dealt with quickly.

I'm wondering though, in my circumstances if economy 7 is right for me. Although there are storage heaters, the flat is empty during the day Monday to Friday generally between 8:30AM and 6PM so it feels like I'm simply using electricity to keep the flat temperate whilst empty and by the time I'm home most of the heat has dissipated, with it never really makes the flat "warm". Between 6PM and midnight electricity is being used for lighting, television/computer and cooking. The only thing constantly on is the fridge/freezer and overnight it's just phone charging, water heating and currently storage heater. With 2 exceptions all the storage heaters also have a more normal "on/off" function that can be used at any point. In these circumstances am i likely to be better off on a "normal" standard rate tariff, coming home to a cold flat and able to just switch on a heater than being on economy 7?

Cardew

It would be most unusual for a property with storage heating not to be better off with E7. Don't forget your hot water for showers/baths etc use off-peak, also appliances.

Are you sure you have the controls on your storage heaters set correctly?

You also need to carefully check you are on the correct tariff for E7. There is a vast difference between companies.

P.S.
You are on a legally binding 'deemed contract' with the company supplying your flat. You need to contact them and then switch to another company if you wish.

HappyMJ

Bamber19 wrote: »

I've recently bought a flat and moved in a couple of weeks ago. Flat is all electric, has an economy 7 dual meter and there are storage heaters throughout. I've not yet signed up to any electricity company nor have I been able to track my usage as the meter appears to be busted given it has the same readings today as it did when I moved in a couple of weeks back and this is obviously something that needs dealt with quickly.

I'm wondering though, in my circumstances if economy 7 is right for me. Although there are storage heaters, the flat is empty during the day Monday to Friday generally between 8:30AM and 6PM so it feels like I'm simply using electricity to keep the flat temperate whilst empty and by the time I'm home most of the heat has dissipated, with it never really makes the flat "warm". Between 6PM and midnight electricity is being used for lighting, television/computer and cooking. The only thing constantly on is the fridge/freezer and overnight it's just phone charging, water heating and currently storage heater. With 2 exceptions all the storage heaters also have a more normal "on/off" function that can be used at any point. In these circumstances am i likely to be better off on a "normal" standard rate tariff, coming home to a cold flat and able to just switch on a heater than being on economy 7?

Are you turning the output dial down to zero each night?

Summer bills will be slightly higher on E7 than a standard tariff but winter bills should be much less. Over the year they balance out. If you use the E7 heating then E7 will be cheaper and if you use panel heating then you should consider switching to a tariff which has a higher night rate and a lower normal rate which should end up being very similar to a standard tariff.

Bamber19

HappyMJ wrote: »

Are you turning the output dial down to zero each night?

Summer bills will be slightly higher on E7 than a standard tariff but winter bills should be much less. Over the year they balance out. If you use the E7 heating then E7 will be cheaper and if you use panel heating then you should consider switching to a tariff which has a higher night rate and a lower normal rate which should end up being very similar to a standard tariff.

Cardew wrote: »

It would be most unusual for a property with storage heating not to be better off with E7. Don't forget your hot water for showers/baths etc use off-peak, also appliances.

Are you sure you have the controls on your storage heaters set correctly?

You also need to carefully check you are on the correct tariff for E7. There is a vast difference between companies.

P.S.
You are on a legally binding 'deemed contract' with the company supplying your flat. You need to contact them and then switch to another company if you wish.

Yeah, I really need to contact them although it will be made slightly more difficult, working out what they will charge for the last couple of weeks, given the meter doesn't seem to be working (this would surely be some coincidence for it to have stopped just as I buy the property?)

I think I have the controls set correctly, there's one with a more confusing set of controls but the main sitting room one has just 2 dials, one for input and one for output. I've played about with the input over the last week or so but have had it on full with the output at 0 throughout the day so in theory should only be letting out minimum heat and then turning that up when I am home.

Shower is electric and requires a pump to be switched on, I may have been misinformed on this but was advised the electric shower was heating water separate from if I ran a bath or a tap for example and is being used just after the off peak period ends.

I work nearby and have came home during the day a few times without adjusting the heater and it feels a lot warmer then than when I come home. I also find that although the heater is sometimes hot to touch it doesn't feel like it actually heats anything beyond a few inches from the heater

I think ultimately the thing on my mind I seem unable to get past is the idea that with storage heaters, even with output low i'm losing a fair chunk of the heat whilst I'm not there and expect in winter i'd have heaters running during peak times also just to make the place passably warm

zaax

Economy 10 might be better

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_10

footyguy

Bamber19 wrote: »

I've recently bought a flat and moved in a couple of weeks ago. Flat is all electric, has an economy 7 dual meter and there are storage heaters throughout. I've not yet signed up to any electricity company nor have I been able to track my usage as the meter appears to be busted given it has the same readings today as it did when I moved in a couple of weeks back and this is obviously something that needs dealt with quickly.

I'm wondering though, in my circumstances if economy 7 is right for me. Although there are storage heaters, the flat is empty during the day Monday to Friday generally between 8:30AM and 6PM so it feels like I'm simply using electricity to keep the flat temperate whilst empty and by the time I'm home most of the heat has dissipated, with it never really makes the flat "warm". Between 6PM and midnight electricity is being used for lighting, television/computer and cooking. The only thing constantly on is the fridge/freezer and overnight it's just phone charging, water heating and currently storage heater. With 2 exceptions all the storage heaters also have a more normal "on/off" function that can be used at any point. In these circumstances am i likely to be better off on a "normal" standard rate tariff, coming home to a cold flat and able to just switch on a heater than being on economy 7?

Consult a comparison site to find the best deal for you.

You'll need to run it twice; once for E7 and once for single rate, and then manually compare the annual costs.

[Deleted User]

You say the meter is "busted ", you ve been in two weeks now and its time you contacted the supplier . Phone the supplier asap please. You know the meter is nt recording usage and its in the suppliers T and Cs to inform them of all faulty meters. You should have already been in contact with them in the first few days to register as a new customer and to enter start readings.
You describe the meter as "busted " so in what way is the meter faulty? Its not that common for meters just to breakdown without the help of human hands. Its my guess that the meter has been bypassed under the lower cover by placing a link wire in place. If it has, then that wire can be overloaded to the state that it starts melting all the cables around it. I ve seen it happening many times.Its dangerous, so make that call to the supplier sooner rather than later. Nevermind comparison sites, sort out that first, its more important.

HappyMJ

zaax wrote: »

Economy 10 might be better

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_10

E10 is in the vast majority of cases (more than 9/10) is more expensive than a "Standard" fixed rate tariffs when managed online and paid by direct debit. E10 has zero competition so the only tariff available is the worst one. E7 and Standard rate tariffs are supported by every supplier and are much cheaper than E10.

The only partially competitive tariff I've found is with Ovo and that's only because they allow an E10 meter to be used with an E7 tariff.

A fully supported E10 tariff normally charges 9p for the "low" rate usage....but I have a standard tariff myself and I pay 9p for ALL of my units.

lstar337

Bamber19 wrote: »

Shower is electric and requires a pump to be switched on, I may have been misinformed on this but was advised the electric shower was heating water separate from if I ran a bath or a tap for example and is being used just after the off peak period ends.

Most electric heated showers don't have a pump. A pump is usually used to get pressure for a shower fed from a hot water tank. This is something you need to investigate.

Bamber19 wrote: »

I work nearby and have came home during the day a few times without adjusting the heater and it feels a lot warmer then than when I come home. I also find that although the heater is sometimes hot to touch it doesn't feel like it actually heats anything beyond a few inches from the heater

I think ultimately the thing on my mind I seem unable to get past is the idea that with storage heaters, even with output low i'm losing a fair chunk of the heat whilst I'm not there and expect in winter i'd have heaters running during peak times also just to make the place passably warm

I think you need to investigate ways to keep the heat in your flat. The heaters are working, you have said as much. So the heat they are producing is leaving as quick, or quicker than they can put it in. Swapping to single rate and panel heating will only result in a huge bill (~300% more) for you.

Start by looking for where the heat is going, then try to stop it.

Bamber19

sacsquacco wrote: »

You say the meter is "busted ", you ve been in two weeks now and its time you contacted the supplier . Phone the supplier asap please. You know the meter is nt recording usage and its in the suppliers T and Cs to inform them of all faulty meters. You should have already been in contact with them in the first few days to register as a new customer and to enter start readings.
You describe the meter as "busted " so in what way is the meter faulty? Its not that common for meters just to breakdown without the help of human hands. Its my guess that the meter has been bypassed under the lower cover by placing a link wire in place. If it has, then that wire can be overloaded to the state that it starts melting all the cables around it. I ve seen it happening many times.Its dangerous, so make that call to the supplier sooner rather than later. Nevermind comparison sites, sort out that first, its more important.

The meter is a digital meter with a display button to switch between screens of information, display is working and the meter looks quite new. I say it is "busted" simply because the readings have remained exactly the same from when I checked over the property the day after exchange to today.

I've spoken to the supplier now and set up with them before being transferred to someone to arrange for them to check the meter, however after half an hour on hold I was met with a message that everyone is busy and to call back later and have therefore arranged for them to call me tomorrow in relation to this.

lstar337 wrote: »

Most electric heated showers don't have a pump. A pump is usually used to get pressure for a shower fed from a hot water tank. This is something you need to investigate.

I think you need to investigate ways to keep the heat in your flat. The heaters are working, you have said as much. So the heat they are producing is leaving as quick, or quicker than they can put it in. Swapping to single rate and panel heating will only result in a huge bill (~300% more) for you.

Start by looking for where the heat is going, then try to stop it.

Why is it likely to rise so much? The standard rate will be lower than the peak but higher than off peak I understand but if I am only switching "ordinary" heaters on when in the flat and when needed I keep thinking i'll use less. I think what I would say is that I'd put a value on being more comfortable that i'd be willing to pay as a premium, it would be somewhat short of paying 300% extra though. I think my answer is i'll stick with it initially and see how we get on but right now it certainly feels like i'll be using peak electricity to top things up a fair bit when i get in from work

Also, obviously as you say investigating the heat loss. The property is a listed conversion, most rooms are quite small though with high ceilings and one obvious area is the windows which are single glazed with a restriction on changing them i'm advised.

mbramwell

I would say 100% yes. I've just been through the same thing the past few months trying to figure out which is best, and if you plan on using your storage heaters, then its a must. I've worked out about 70% of my total electric usage goes on my storage and immersion heater.

One thing you need to do is make 100% sure when your economy 7 rate switches, I've just been having this issue and it's cost me a fair amount of money because I wasn't entirely sure when they were coming on.