Moving Abroad - Australia vs America

boliston

duchy wrote: »

....
New York you'll have little work life balance culture .....

Surely one of the main reasons to live somewhere like NYC would be the huge choice of things to do when you are not at work.

Doshwaster

Beenie wrote: »

Sorry if I have missed this bit, but are you married? Getting a work visa for yourself for NY is one thing (and your employer will sort that out you say) but who will push through a work visa for your partner (if you're not married)?

The US is very hot on visas and it might be difficult if not impossible for him to find legal work.

Yes, that would be a complicating factor. I worked with guy who got a transfer to our US office and the only way his girlfriend could go with him is if they got married very quickly. Even then she wasn't allowed to work over there so took a career break to start a family

movinghelp

No we're not married, together 8 years almost. That's the main barrier to NY.

movinghelp

From speaking to a contact in the US today it seems the only way for my OH to work is if I get an L1 visa and we get married. That way he could get an L2 visa. Has anyone else gone through this process?

HappyMJ

movinghelp wrote: »

From speaking to a contact in the US today it seems the only way for my OH to work is if I get an L1 visa and we get married. That way he could get an L2 visa. Has anyone else gone through this process?

Which bit...the getting married bit is fairly easy. There's no need to make a song and dance about it. Just give notice at a registry office and get married. Being married makes visa applications for either country a lot easier than being an unmarried partner.

Generali

I'm a native Londoner who moved with wife and 2 pre-school aged kids to Sydney in 2008. I've never been to NY and have only really visited Melbourne although I have friends there so can comment on the life too.

Off the bat, Sydney is a great city. The people are friendly for a big city, which took quite some getting used to, and it is a big town. It is however a town of suburbs (and Melbourne even more so AIUI) and so while there is some of that big city culture stuff going on there isn't a huge amount compared to London.

The food is excellent and there is a huge range of choices of fresh food due to the very multi-cultural nature of Sydney. There is an Asian supermarket in just about every large shopping mall and you can get all sorts of interesting stuff if you want. All the ordinary basics you'd expect to find in a UK supermarket are available too. Food prices are on the high side but the quality is a lot better than for a UK supermarket. Red meat is cheap though. What is hard to buy is the very top 1% of excellent food: think the best places in Borough Market for example. There is little in the way of ready meals, Aussies use take away instead or eat at the local RSL/bowlo.

Work can be tricky to get at first. Aussies have a big thing about 'local experiece'. Once you get the first job it's okay but getting the first job can be tough. You pay tax on a PAYE (PAYG it's called here) at broadly similar rates to the UK but at the end of the year you fill in a tax return. The best thing is to get a tax agent to do it which costs a few hundred dollars and you should get $1-2,000 back which is a nice annual bonus. When looking at salaries, check whether Super (compulsory employer pension contributions at 9.5%) are included or excluded in the figure you are quoted.

Staying in. The main terrestrial TV stations are supported by what they think of as the 3 pillars: sport, reality TV and news. A typical evening of TV in Aus would probably be an hour long news show followed by a 90 minute reality TV show and then a movie or a couple of those American dramas (NCIS or something). There is plenty of UK TV on the main channels and during the day at the weekend the TV shows vast amounts of sport (Rugby League in Sydney, Aussie Rules in Melbourne).

Aussies are quite into going to each other's houses for an evening. If you are invited you're generally expected to bring your own booze if you want to have a drink although that isn't always the case (I'm still getting to grips with this bit after 8 years!).

Going out Aussies like going to the pub after work but you don't get anything like the same public drunkenness that you get in the UK. If you have too much to drink you won't get served in the pub and will probably be asked to leave. Police patrol pubs to make sure you are reasonably sober still. Meals out can range from a $10 steak in a pub to gourmet meals. The big thing that Aus has that don't really exist in the UK are clubs, the biggest group being the Returned Servicemen's League or RSL.

The clubs are kinda members only. It costs about $10 to join for 3-5 years and memberships save you 10% off food and drink. You have to be a member or the guest of a member to use a club within 3kms of your house but you can go as an independent guest outside 3kms. They offer pretty cheap food, normally in a separate restaurant area and drink plus will have sporting facilities. The one I am a member of is massive with 3 bars, 3 restaurants plus rooms for hire. It has bowling, soccer, footie (rugby league/AFL), a gym, netball, youth club, cricket, basketball and a fishing club. I pay $10 for 5 years although gym membership is extra.

Getting About Driving is basically necessary in Australia be it Melbourne or Sydney due to the suburban nature of the place. DO NOT DRIVE DRUNK AS YOU WILL LOSE YOUR LICENCE. They have Random Breath Testing in Aus where they pull over basically everyone that is passing. These run from Thursday night through to Sunday night and they are particularly hot on Saturday and Sunday mornings.

Speed cameras are plentiful and should be clearly signed (in NSW anyway, don't know about Victoria). Ditto red light cameras. In the morning and afternoon, you have to do 40kph outside schools. There are big signs to remind you.

Travel times are generally predictable depending on the time of day. I know that going along Victoria Rd from my suburb to my BiL's house will take about an hour in rush hour or about 25 mins at the weekend or out of rush hour and is very unlikely to be different.

Cycling facilities are pretty good. There are lots of shared paths in the suburbs and separate cycle lanes in the cities. Offices in the city tend to have showers, lockers, bike sheds and mine even has ironing boards!

Public transport from the suburbs to the city is generally okay but getting from suburb to suburb by PT is difficult and time consuming (depending on how lucky you are on the bus/train service). Intercity travel is either via car or plane. You can drive from one city to the next in about a day (i.e. I can go to Melbourne in a day's drive or Brisbane in a day's drive). Inter city planes are plentiful and cheap. To get anywhere in the middle you will basically have to drive.

Beach Culture/Sport There is a massive beach culture in Aus. Surfing is massive and it is normal for a surfer in a proper professional job to come in late occasionally because the surf was amazing that morning. Nobody minds as long as they make up the time. Families go to the beach for the afternoon to play informal sport, groups of teens will go to jump the waves and old men go to fish. Boating is also very popular.

Everyone watches and discusses sport and it is very normal for women to play and attend sports. If you go to a sporting event there will be a lot of women and families in the crowd and you will be expected to behave as if you are in a family environment although most grounds have an 'adult only' section for people that want to chant and sing.

Culture Aussies, despite their reputation, are a highly conformist bunch and quite parochial. This is something I really struggle with. If you are cosmopolitan and like to discuss things from other countries or different ideas then you need to pick your friends in Aus. Politics basically aren't discussed apart from on the TV/radio. People are law abiding and I have even been told off by colleagues for crossing the road on a red man!

Enjoyment of the arts is uncommon and you get laughed at generally if you go to the opera or theatre. This stuff is available but most people keep their enjoyment of things like that to themselves.

Most big pop/rock bands visit Aus on big tours and tickets go fast. If Katie Perry/Prince(RIP)/The Rolling Stones are your thing you'll be well catered for.

We get the movie blockbusters at the same time as everyone else and you can normally see the smaller UK films a few months after the UK. Arthouse films are available but you have to look for them.

Overall am I glad I moved? Yes. Will I be buried here? Probably not.

Generali

movinghelp wrote: »

No we're not married, together 8 years almost. That's the main barrier to NY.

For Australia that would count as married.

movinghelp

HappyMJ wrote: »

Which bit...the getting married bit is fairly easy. There's no need to make a song and dance about it. Just give notice at a registry office and get married. Being married makes visa applications for either country a lot easier than being an unmarried partner.

I mean got the L1 visa themselves and then L2 for their other half.

Thanks Generali for all the detailed info, it's really helpful. Totally understand the points re drink driving (which I wouldn't anyway) and speeding. I was warned about these when we traveled in Feb.

Generali

movinghelp wrote: »

I mean got the L1 visa themselves and then L2 for their other half.

Thanks Generali for all the detailed info, it's really helpful. Totally understand the points re drink driving (which I wouldn't anyway) and speeding. I was warned about these when we traveled in Feb.

Most people I know that have been nabbed have been got at 8am taking the kids to sport, still a bit over.

Happy to answer any further questions.

callum9999

Generali's post is generally great, but I have to slightly disagree with the transport section.

You don't necessarily need a car if you live in Melbourne or Sydney. It can help, and public transport isn't remotely as good as it is in London, but whether it's crucial to have a car or not will wholly depend on the suburb. I could get anywhere I needed to in Sydney on public transport (though I lived in the centre and rarely went to the suburbs) and I lived in a Melbourne suburb that again, let me get around the area and to the city easily on public transport.

Depending on how far (or how cheaply!) you want to go, Greyhound or the train is an option between cities (I wouldn't want to take the Greyhound from Melbourne to Cairns, but Sydney to Newcastle is fine on the train!). The train from Country Victoria to Melbourne was quite nice too (though I wouldn't repeat the Melbourne to Sydney night train...).

That being said, my perspective is from a non-Londoner, so for you the step down in public transport quality would be more noticeable!