lodger or tenant

ben01011900

Help please
In September 2014 I had to move out of my property due to ill health (needed to live with a carer). I got a lodger to move in and all was relatively fine until this year.
The lodger has lost their job and states that they have applied for housing benefit in January but haven't been paid anything from the Council.
The lodger was given a lodger agreement in January as they needed it for their claim, this had an end date of 31/3/16.
No payment has been made since February so they are technically 2 months in arrears as the rent is due in advance on the first day of the month.
I have given them one months notice to leave before 2/5.
They have stated that they will not move out and I will have to go to court to evict them.
My main question is are they a lodger or a tenant as the place I moved into is a holiday home so I am still liable for the Council Tax on my property and it is legally considered to be my only permanent residence.
To add insult to injury there has been a dog present when I have been round to pick up my post. The lodger stated that they were just looking after it for the day for a friend but when I have since picked up my post dog bowls were on the floor and the house is full of dog hair. Their lodger agreement states that having a pet is a breach.
I am going to move back in this weekend as I am sick with stress and cannot eat or sleep for worry about the situation and property.
All advice gratefully received.

Guest101

They're a tenant.


There isn't such a thing as 'legally considered to be my only permanent residence'


Stop going round there, as you'll be faced with a harassment charge next, since the tenant is now aware of their rights.


DO NOT MOVE BACK IN. that would be a criminal offence.

Guest101

Onto the solution:


Issue a section 21 and section 8 notice, two separate documents.


Did you protect their deposit? If not return this.


Did you comply with Gas safety and EPC?


Did you declare money to tax man?


Does your mortgage provider know the situation?


All things to be considered.


**Alternatively pay the tenant to leave.**

theartfullodger

Did your lodger agreement specify which bit of the house was his?? e.g. did it say "lodger at 63 Acacia Avenue..." or "lodger for room 2 at 63 Acacia Avenue...").

The terms of the lodger agreement largely still stand (rent amount, what rooms he has access to..) but as you moved out it is an AST (regardless of what paperwork says) so as indicated above, issue s21 & s8 TODAY! Err.. oops! no.. just seen

The lodger was given a lodger agreement in January as they needed it for their claim, this had an end date of 31/3/16...

As that is an AST starting after 01/10/2015 any s21 is only valid after 4 months and only if deposit correctly handled, EPC & GSC & "How to rent" booklets served prior on tenant: So if you have no EPC or GSC get them, which tenant may not wish to permit. So earliest you could serve s21 would be same start date-of-month of lodger agreement in May 2016. Expires 2 months later July 2016 then you can apply to court. You can serve s8 but unlikely to get possession any earlier with that & risky for court costs. Note for s8 it is not "arrears" but unpaid rent... but serve one anyway (s8 g10,11, 8 as applies at least..)

What insurance cover do you have for buildings and contents?? Who has been paying what for council tax? Whose name are the electric & gas bills in?

As it is an AST, even as he is not paying rent it is his home, his property not your property: It is currently but your "investment".
http://www.landlordlawblog.co.uk/2010/08/31/urban-myth-when-a-landlord-lets-a-property-its-still-his/

Re. holiday home did you breach any "only for 11 months" conditions??

As you could accommodate a lodger how come you couldn;t have carer there rather than at holiday home: How are you otherwise involved with the "carer"??

Did you inform any benefit agency about your rental income?? Certainly carer's allowance is affected by income, I understand...(not 100% sure on that..)

What a mess.

ben01011900

The agreement states "the room at the property which has been agreed between the householder and lodger to be taken by the lodger", "the shared areas: means the rooms in the property which the householder has agreed can be used by the lodger on a shared basis with the householder and any other people living at the property including the bathrom, kitchen, sitting room"
He never paid a deposit.
I had to leave my property as i was mentally ill and it was a choice of moving into a holiday home that my new partner lived in or be committed to a hospital as I wasn't safe to be left alone (bi polar disorder). My partner is not an official "carer" we both work and do not claim any benefits (I was off sick from work for a period)
We haven't breached the 11 month holiday home period, in Jan 2015 i moved back into my house for a month and this year we stayed with friends.
I do not want to fall out with him, i want him to use the money he gets backdated to use to move out with, effectively paying him to move out.
Thanks for all the advice i will investigate all the above.

ben01011900

forgot to say all the bills are in my name and i am liable for the council tax as you cannot be liable for the council tax on an 11 month holiday home so the council has him down as a lodger and i don't get 25% single person discount as they class me and him as residents

GwylimT

He lives in a home where the landlord is not resident, he is not a lodger, he is a tenant.

Guest101

ben01011900 wrote: »

The agreement states "the room at the property which has been agreed between the householder and lodger to be taken by the lodger", - Still a tenant. "the shared areas: means the rooms in the property which the householder has agreed can be used by the lodger on a shared basis with the householder and any other people living at the property including the bathrom, kitchen, sitting room" - is there anyone else living there?
He never paid a deposit. - Good.
I had to leave my property as i was mentally ill and it was a choice of moving into a holiday home that my new partner lived in or be committed to a hospital as I wasn't safe to be left alone (bi polar disorder). My partner is not an official "carer" we both work and do not claim any benefits (I was off sick from work for a period) - whilst unfortunate, and I hope you're feeling better, it's irrelevant to this discussion.
We haven't breached the 11 month holiday home period, in Jan 2015 i moved back into my house for a month and this year we stayed with friends. - irrelevant.
I do not want to fall out with him, i want him to use the money he gets backdated to use to move out with, effectively paying him to move out. - Not quite the same thing.
Thanks for all the advice i will investigate all the above.

ben01011900 wrote: »

forgot to say all the bills are in my name and i am liable for the council tax as you cannot be liable for the council tax on an 11 month holiday home so the council has him down as a lodger - no, they have him as an occupier. and i don't get 25% single person discount as they class me and him as residents

Now of this changes him being a tenant. So the above still applies regarding gas safety certificates, tax and your lender.

Pixie5740

You can try Shelter's Tenancy Rights Checker if you want but I'm pretty sure it will come back saying that he is really a tenant. Mostly because of this question:

Do any of the following apply to you?

a) I live in the same house and share living space with my landlord
b) I live in the same building as my landlord but we do not share any living space
c) I'm provided with services as part of my rent (cleaning, provision of meals or laundry)
d) None of these options apply to me

pmlindyloo

ben01011900 wrote: »

Help please
In September 2014 I had to move out of my property due to ill health (needed to live with a carer). I got a lodger to move in and all was relatively fine until this year.
The lodger has lost their job and states that they have applied for housing benefit in January but haven't been paid anything from the Council.
The lodger was given a lodger agreement in January as they needed it for their claim, this had an end date of 31/3/16.
No payment has been made since February so they are technically 2 months in arrears as the rent is due in advance on the first day of the month.
I have given them one months notice to leave before 2/5.
They have stated that they will not move out and I will have to go to court to evict them.
My main question is are they a lodger or a tenant as the place I moved into is a holiday home so I am still liable for the Council Tax on my property and it is legally considered to be my only permanent residence.
To add insult to injury there has been a dog present when I have been round to pick up my post. The lodger stated that they were just looking after it for the day for a friend but when I have since picked up my post dog bowls were on the floor and the house is full of dog hair. Their lodger agreement states that having a pet is a breach.
I am going to move back in this weekend as I am sick with stress and cannot eat or sleep for worry about the situation and property.
All advice gratefully received.

Although I tend to agree with everyone that he appears more likely to be a tenant rather than a lodger, I do think that it might be worth checking this out by telephoning Shelter with the lodger agreement in front of him.

Not totally sure how often the OP visits the property, where all his correspondence is addressed to, whether he retains a bedroom there etc etc.

Can't find much about absentee landlords just a bit about it having to be the landlord's 'principle' home.

Hope the OP updates.

booksurr

pmlindyloo wrote: »

Can't find much about absentee landlords just a bit about it having to be the landlord's 'principle' home.

principles matter, but in reality whether it is the principAl home is a question subject to numerous case law judgments all of which say there is no simple definition, it is down to individual circumstances and how they match certain tests....
- where does he work & commute from
- where is his family (his carer lives elsewhere!)
- where do/did people expect to find him
- where does he spend most of his time
- where is he registered
- where does his post go

I doubt the OP would meet enough of the tests to establish it remains his main home in which he is resident. The OP has established a house share in which an occupying tenant has use of a room and common facilities whilst his LL may occasionally also use the property. Naturally a "lodger" agreement is not worth the paper it is written on in that case