Unable to install a meter and yet being moved to meter assessed tariff

JLSD

HI,
I just received a letter from Southern Water stating that while they cannot install a meter for our home, they have still switched us from an unmetered charge to a metered assessed charge.... the estimated bill for next year is 195% more expensive than the current one!! Can they do that?
I would prefer have them install a meter, the charge is based on the size of the household (3 bedrooms) but we are very eco friendly family and very careful with our consumption. We used to live in an area supplied by Thames Water and our bills were usually 100 pounds for 6 months, the bill we are asked to pay is approx 475 pounds for a year. I find this totally abusive but have no idea how to oppose this.
Thanks!!!

macman

There is as far s I know no obligation to go onto an assessed charge if a meter cannot be fitted. An inspection is done, if metering is not possible then you can then apply for an assessed charge if you wish. Otherwise you should remain on RV billing. So I don't understand what is going on here, unless its relates to the SW area being an area of high water stress where metering is being imposed on a compulsory basis?
But I am surprised that an assessed charge is higher than the RV billing, unless you have an unusually low RV.
You cannot compare prices between regions, since some regions charge up to 250% more than others per unit, SWW being the most expensive nationally.

Cardew

JLSD wrote: »

HI,

We used to live in an area supplied by Thames Water and our bills were usually 100 pounds for 6 months, the bill we are asked to pay is approx 475 pounds for a year. I find this totally abusive but have no idea how to oppose this.
Thanks!!!

As said above, there is no point in comparing charges for your house in Thames Water's area, with your house in Southern Water's area.

As you presumably have just moved, Southern Water can(normally) insist that a water meter is fitted. However if one cannot be fitted(as in your case) you will be offered the opportunity to have an assessed charge. This from Southern's website

If we can’t fit a meter

If we cannot fit a meter, we will offer you an alternative charge. This would be an assessed charge, based on the number
of bedrooms in your home or, where applicable, on single occupancy. If we cannot fit a meter and you decide
move to our assessed charge, etc etc

So you don't need to accept an assessed charge and can remain on charges based on the Rateable Value(RV) if you wish. However you need to determine how much those RV based charges will be, as you may find them more expensive than the £475 for an assessed charge.

JLSD

Thanks. Yes, the letter states "the region in which we live is under serious water stress". But they say they cannot install the meter - funnily enough my neighbours next door (semi detached, attached to our house) have a meter.
I was comparing the cost of water based on consumption - Southern Water might be more expensive than Thames Water, but I would not expect our consumption to be much higher.
I will wait to get the response from Southern customer service, and take it from there.

matelodave

Has a man been round to look or have they just taken the easy option.

My mum had a water meter fitted with a transducer unit adjacent to the inside stop tap with a remote display on the wall outside.

Ours is in a hole in the front garden

Cardew

JLSD wrote: »

Thanks. Yes, the letter states "the region in which we live is under serious water stress". But they say they cannot install the meter - funnily enough my neighbours next door (semi detached, attached to our house) have a meter.
I was comparing the cost of water based on consumption - Southern Water might be more expensive than Thames Water, but I would not expect our consumption to be much higher.
I will wait to get the response from Southern customer service, and take it from there.

How does the cost of your present bill, based on Rateable Value(RV), compare with the £475 you have been quoted for an assessed charge?

JJ_Egan

£475 pa is not at all expensive .
Suggest you compare that with your water charges based upon Rateable Value .

matelodave

I think you need to read the T&C's

"Where a meter is not installed
under South East Water's CMP
If South East Water is unable to meter the
water supply to your home under their CMP,
you will switch from paying unmetered
sewerage charges to paying assessed
sewerage charges, which are based on the
number of bedrooms in your home or on
single occupancy.
Once this switch has taken place, assessed
sewerage charges will always be payable,
unless circumstances should change at a
later date which allow South East Water to
meter your water supply. In these
circumstances, your sewerage charges will
switch from assessed charges to metered
charges following the installation of the
meter"

It seems to imply that certain areas are covered by their Customer Metering Program (CMP) which looks like they can impose assessed charges even if they don't fit a meter

Have a read of all of this

https://www.southernwater.co.uk/Media/Default/PDFs/MeteringChgsGuide_2015_16.pdf

and this - Can I change back to unmetered charges?
South East Water has embarked on a major programme to install meters for 90
per cent of its customers by 2020. You can apply to have a meter installed earlier
than the date scheduled by the programme but you will not be able to revert to
unmetered charges if the programme has reached your area or we are scheduled to
install your water meter during the following year.
The current programme of metering installations can be viewed on our website at
southeastwater.co.uk/meter. You need to check if you are or have just moved into in a CMP area

Cardew

matelodave wrote: »

I think you need to read the T&C's

Thanks for this link. It was not immediately apparent that the OP was on the Compulsory Metering Program.(CMP) However I must admit to not having read the small print of the CMP.


It is about time that water companies took some action to end the stupidity of properties paying water charges based Rateable Value(RV)on a notional rent the property could command when last assessed - which for most was 1973 or if built after that date up to 1990. The companies were empowered to end RV based charges when the property had a new occupant(owner or tenant.) However many companies never bothered because they got their revenue, and hence profit, without enforcement. i.e. those on low RV based charges were subsidised by other customers paying more.


Also a house on RV charges should declare any improvements that would have affected their original RV assessment e.g fitting Central heating, building a garage etc. As I have written previously I know of mansions in several acres that were virtually derelict in 1973 and have a lower RV than a 2 bed estate semi. They have now been modernised are worth £millions and are obviously Band H for Council Tax, yet still pay water charges based on their original RV.


Whilst the above are extreme cases, there are many other(the majority?) that should have ceased paying on RV based charges.


Anyway getting back to the OP's case he has been told his assessed charge will be £475. (i.e. with SWD included)


On RV based charges he would pay £77 in Standing Charges and £2.05 for each £1 of Rateable Value. Thus if his house has an RV of £194 he would be paying the same £475 as on assessed charges. A lower RV and he is out of pocket and a higher RV and he gains. I suspect that an RV of around £200 is average for a 3 bed semi.


Edit
The OP doesn't state the size of his family. However if he was metered and had average consumption(55 m3 per person pa) he would pay:


For 2 people: £470


For 3 people: £662


For 4 people: £855


So it seem unlikely that being on a meter would be cheaper than the assessed charge.

[Deleted User]

OK. I have had the exact same letter. Only I was up until January living half a mile down the road, with a meter that was installed 18 months ago. Initially I was paying £36 a month, but am very sparing with the water I use, and had got it down to £22 a month (apparently same as their estimated useage for a 1 bed property which says it all as to how good their guesses are).

Now I am going to be charged £475 a year (apparently my old unmetered charge was £403.84 so basically they are putting it up by £75 a year even comparing rateable to their assessed metered useage).

But for me, it means I am going up from £22 a month on a real metered system, to an assessed metered charge of £39.58 - both Southern Water. I live in a block of council maisonettes. However, apparently they are very kindly only going to charge me £35 a month for the first year, Can I insist a meter is put in? I am ground floor.

[Deleted User]

Just tried to engage with Southern Water through live chat - really helpful

Pouloomi: Hello. My name is Pouloomi, how may I help you?
You : Hello, my account number now is <xxxx>, just been told I am moving to an assessed meter charge of £471 a month. Up until January i lived half a mile down the road with a meter (<xxxxx>) and was charged half that a month - on a real meter. So the assessed charge is completely inaccurate
You : I want a meter, at this address. Its a ground floor maisonette. The assessed charge is double what I was paying with a real meter and its wrong.
Pouloomi: Agent closed console without ending chat