Insulating entire home?

Moneymaker

I just saw this article "Government needs to cut consumer energy bills through energy efficiency".
http://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/energy-and-climate-change-committee/news-parliament-2015/home-energy-report-published-15-16/

Since the government won't be helping any time soon, it made me wonder whether anyone has money-saving tips for insulating a home really cheaply?

Chucking more insulation in the loft is easy enough (but you have to wear goggles and protective clothing so do it before summer otherwise you'll melt) but how can I afford to buy it? Is straw cheaper or maybe it's a fire risk?

Windows can have a sheet of polycarbonate added - I did that in a previous house - and it doesn't go yellow as quickly as perspex does. But I can only afford polythene sheeting for now.

What about insulating walls and ceilings cheaply? (Preferably free.)
Safety considerations?
What insulating material to use and what thickness? I guess anything is better than nothing but it needs to produce a decent energy saving otherwise it's not worth the effort.

My walls are built with rendered continental "air bricks" (I don't know the correct description). Bricks with lots of air holes, similar to this:

I think someone thought it was a good idea when the house was built, decades ago! But there's hardly any insulation.

Anyway, I thought this might make an interesting topic for discussion.
How to save money by insulating and how to save money when buying insulating materials?

Martyn1981

Hi Moneymaker. If you're looking at cheap options, then you can add extra insulation to windows with bubblewrap. Just wipe them with a damp cloth, and it should stick. But (of course) it will make the windows look like distorted glass.

Regarding loft insulation. Unless you have some sort of allergy, it's not that bad. Two options, buy a paper suit (cheap), or do the opposite and strip down to shorts and T shirt then 'slap yourself down' afterwards. Probably cost you around £100, depending on loft size.

I've used some stuff from B&Q recently, overhead and under some floorboards. I didn't find it bad at all. Not sure if their product is a little better, or if it's all got a little less dusty. Hardly any coughing, and almost no irritation to arms (I never bother with gloves, it doesn't seem to affect my hands.)

At the other end of the cost scale, from what you describe with your bricks, would be EWI (external wall insulation), which would probably work really well for you, but the cost would be very high, perhaps £5k+, but the gains should be impressive.

Mart.

Moneymaker

Thanks for your reply. The loft has about 3" of fibreglass but it seems to be falling apart and last time I was up there it caused really bad wheezing (like asthma). I'll have to price up B&Q's offerings.

I've heard of EWI but no idea how to attach it and weather proof it. Is it a DIY job? It's a 2 storey detached house and I'm not good on ladders.
I get my state pension in a few months so I'll be able to start saving!

Martyn1981

Moneymaker wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. The loft has about 3" of fibreglass but it seems to be falling apart and last time I was up there it caused really bad wheezing (like asthma). I'll have to price up B&Q's offerings.

I've heard of EWI but no idea how to attach it and weather proof it. Is it a DIY job? It's a 2 storey detached house and I'm not good on ladders.
I get my state pension in a few months so I'll be able to start saving!

Morning. 3" of old stuff will be very inefficient, and probably best to remove, rather than top up. Forget what I said about 'not so bad', the old stuff, plus dust will be horrible, so kit up, paper suit, face mask and gloves, work slowly rolling it up (as best you can) and bagging it in plastic bin bags. Also watch your step.

Do some 'internetting' for advice on new insulation, ideally 12". Try 2 layers of 6", the first between the ceiling joists, then the second at 90d. Should be really simple and fast, but at 12" will cost more.

However, that's one of the fastest and cheapest ways to save energy and money.

Just to repeat, I doubt the B&Q stuff is special, I suspect the product itself is now less dusty, but that's what I used, and whilst I was happy to accept some coughing and itchy arms, I was surprised how little there was.


EWI is a major job, and you'll need to get your house accessed, you'll also need to consider overhangs and windows, downpipes etc as some of these may need work since you'll be adding around 5"+ to the outside of your property. this is something you want to research fully, and ideally chat with neighbours or folk on forums about to get ideas on prices and possible companies.

Mart.

Exiled_Tyke

I tend to agree with Martyn. The B&Q product is far easier to work with than any insulation I've previously used and I needed very little protection to put it down. I'd be tempted to leave the old stuff down as it is pretty nasty to move and I see it that 'every little helps' although it won't be doing much.

I have a bedroom with huge but little used wardrobes on the north facing wall. I've filled them with bags of shredded paper and it's made a significant difference. When I have the money I will cover the walls with internal insulation panels as there is no need for the expensive of plastering over and making good.

I presume from your original post that you are certain the building is single skinned with no cavity to fill? I only mention it because I know a number of people who thought they had no cavity when they did (none with you air bricks though).

I've also seen recommendations of growing evergreen climbers on the outside of walls to create extra insulation. Ivy is good but I do think it causes damage. Garrya elliptica 'James Roof' is very good for north facing walls with good spread (eventually) and a reasonably attractive plant. You could make a difference for as little as £30 but will have to wait for the results!

Alan_Brown

Have you looked at making your house more airtight? Fitting insulated letterbox covers, draught excluders around doors, filling cracks in plasterboard. If you're quite handy and don't mind the disruption, you could lift the floorboards and put insulation in the 1st floor ceiling/floor void. If you have a void/crawlspace under the ground floor you could install insulation under there too. If you have floor boards then make sure any gaps are filled.

Do you have a water cylinder? If yes, then make sure it's lagged. Alternatively you could replace this with a combi boiler which gives you hot water on demand. If you are/will be in receipt of pensions credit then you may qualify for a free boiler.

Your walls have insulation built into the bricks due to all those holes in the bricks. At age 65(?) you'd struggle to break even for the tens of thousands of pounds it would cost you to install EWI, especially if you have carried out the improvements already mentioned.

EricMears

Martyn1981 wrote: »

3" of old stuff will be very inefficient, and probably best to remove, rather than top up. Forget what I said about 'not so bad', the old stuff, plus dust will be horrible, so kit up, paper suit, face mask and gloves, work slowly rolling it up (as best you can) and bagging it in plastic bin bags. Also watch your step.

I'd take a slightly different view.

Assuming you don't want to do a loft conversion in next few years or use loft for regular storage (I know we all do but it's a bad idea) I'd suggest laying a new layer of something better on top of old fibreglass. The f/g may not be very efficient but it will still be better than nothing so will make (a small) contribution to insulation efficiency and you'll stir up less dust by covering it than you would by removing it. You'll still need all the kit Martyn describes.

After you've done that and still want to use some of loft for storage (don't do it - buy a garden shed instead !) it will be much less unpleasant to enter loft and you could always consider putting extra layers of wood above existing joists then laying boards across them (to avoid compressing new insulation).

Martyn1981

ET & Eric, I kinda agree about leaving the old stuff, as it's absolutely horrible to move ...... but ..... I think the crucial decision is whether 12" more will be added on top, which is fine, or if it'll be made up to 12" with 9" more, which I don't think is fine, as the old stuff will be degraded and fill of dust, so will have a lower value now.

If it was me, I'd take it up, but I'd wear a really good face mask, a decent cloth one (not a 10 for £1 paper jobbie) or even a £20 filter mask. Clothing wise, paper suit, or oldest DIY/gardening clothes, then strip off in the garden and straight in the bin.

@Alan, I was nodding along to the insulating bricks, as air is a fantastic insulator, though I think gaps have to be 12mm or less to prevent circulation and the transmission of heat/cold across the gaps ...... however, looking at the picture, I don't think those bricks would help much as there is so much thermal bridging, the solid bits between each hole, allowing heat/cold to simply travel around the air gap.

I'm not sure if my theory is correct, and you may be 100% right, but I'd be interested if anyone knows the answer. Thanks.

Mart.

zeupater

Hi

It's all pretty simple really .... with only 3" of loft insulation there's no need to ponder about the entire project as attempting to set priorities & budgets will just delay what you need to do, which is keep warm and reduce your heating bills by getting loft insulation down ASAP. Have a look at what deals are available now as it'll even start paying for itself over the next few months before the weather really warms up, however, the large DIY sheds normally have rolls of 'Knauf' (or similar) rockwool on offer late Summer or early Autumn so don't pay over the odds, but then again don't waste pounds on heatloss whilst chasing pennies of savings on the insulation ....

You should be looking at 270/300mm thick insulation layer to meet current recommendations, however, only having patchy 75mm (3") insulation in place means that anything laid now will greatly improve the current situation ... you can always add more in the future. Rolls are normally available in approx 100/150/170/200mm thickness versions, the first 100mm should provide the best return with greater thicknesses providing progressively deminishing savings .... we have ~200sqm of loft insulated to ~500mm and although there are still savings to be had if we added more, any payback period just really wouldn't be worth it with the money being better spent elsewhere ...

HTH
Z

Ben84

There's actually more to consider with the loft than I realised until I thought about it.

First of all, some safety. If you have spotlight bulbs fitted in the ceiling, many of these fixtures are not supposed to be covered with insulation as they can overheat. They're also terrible for energy saving. They leak heat and air through them in to the loft, and when you turn on the hot bulb it convects even more air through them. If you don't have them, you're in luck. If you do have them, you'll have to investigate the options, as insulating the loft around them will be rather futile when it's full of holes that turn in to power vents every time you switch the lights on.

Another safety issue, you're not supposed to insulate under any water tanks (we have cold water tank and a boiler expansion tank) as there's a risk of them freezing in winter, and the heat from the house below will make this much less likely. Generally, insulating the loft means your risk of any water containing things up there freezing increases. I did not insulate under the tanks, but I did insulate the sides and install insulated lids - which is a good thing to do anyway as open tanks mean any dirt floating around in the loft can end up in your drinking water or adding dirt to your heating system. I also insulated some pipes connected to the tanks to protect them too.

Then there's air leaks. A likely place to find these is the edges of the loft door - I put rubber seals (same as you'd use on an outside door) around that, and stuck some insulation board to the back side of the wooden door itself. There's also the gaps around pipes and cables that go through the ceiling, which I put silicone in. It was worth looking inside the light fixtures as these turned out to be hiding big holes.

So, quite a lot needed to be done before I even reached the point where I opened any rolls of insulation. We already had about 75mm between the joists, which was in good enough condition, so I placed a further 200mm at 90 degrees across the top of the joists. Covering the joists reduces thermal bridging from them. I used glass wool as it's completely non-flammable and nothing can eat it. However, I suspect it's unhealthy stuff to inhale the dust from, so I did use a good mask that said it protected against fibreglass.

Moneymaker

All good points, thanks. The water tank sits on bare rafters with only plasterboard ceiling beneath. The tank is surrounded and covered by thin (1/2") polystyrene sheet. Easy enough to replace with thicker sheet.

I hate spotlights; they give me migraine! So no worries there.