Harder now for 1st time buyers?

littlegreenfrog_2

looknohands wrote: »

A Tesco worker is making Tesco's a lot more money than he/she is worth which is profit Tesco pay tax on, Tesco also have loads of suppliers in the UK all of which pay tax, so the Tesco worker is a link in this whole chain of business that is the UK economy. Also how does the Tesco worker spend his / her money? it might all go back into the UK economy, maybe the lower wages force Tesco workers into taking a staycation?

Me... all of my clients in 2014 were overseas, I paid £14,000 income tax that year some at higher rate like you, However i feel I'm nowhere near as valuable to the economy as someone working at Tesco. None of my clients paid any tax in this country and none of the things I made for them benefited any other part of the economy in this country, essentially nothing I did except paying tax helped anything to do with this countries economy.

Add to that I grow a lot of my own food and I traveled abroad a lot, so I spent most of my income in other countries.

Income tax is not a measure of your economic contribution!

I'm not saying that people who work in Tesco don't contribute to the economy. Of course they do. I'm just saying I make a bigger contribution to the economy using my taxpayer-subsidised education and professional training to do the job that I currently do than I would if I jacked it all in and went to work in Tesco in Port Talbot (and took an employment opportunity away from somebody else).

To suggest otherwise is ludicrous.

makeyourdaddyproud

...(and took an employment opportunity away from somebody else)

But you have not; your old job would soon be filled by someone similarly skilled and paying tax at more or less the same rate.

In fact, by simply changing jobs, you're introducing several processes/businesses during re-employment, most likely agencies, and skills testing organisations, all of which will invoke tax on revenue.

Or, by staying put, you are implicitly keeping someone longer on the dole by denying someone your job by not leaving.

As stated earlier, supermarket workers are a valuable customer facing part of the goods supply chain. Though they pay little tax, they actually contribute more than some very highly paid workers that only push pens and sit steadfastly insignificant in middle tier roles such as middle management and consulting.

littlegreenfrog_2

I am not denying that people who work in Tesco contribute to the economy. I just don't see how it could possibly be an economically efficient outcome for me to leave the job I currently do and take a job I am overqualified for in an area of high unemployment. You don't know what I do so I'm not sure why you're assuming I'm some kind of overpaid paper shuffler - although my salary means I paid about as much tax last year as a minimum wage worker earns, and my spending power helped me to boost the economy in a way I could not have done if I was earning the minimum wage. I'm finding your line of argument a bit silly really.

looknohands

But it's wrong to say you contribute more or less than someone based on salary, you don't really know you're just basing it on income and income tax which is in noway a fair representation of someones economic value.

It's like saying Adam Applegarth contributed a great deal to the economy because he paid income tax on his £700k salary... we'd be better off if he had just worked at Tesco!

littlegreenfrog_2

I think you're getting a bit hung up on this one point which isn't really relevant to the thread. The point is, my job is necessary and someone has to do it. Just like we need people to be doctors and nurses and teachers and engineers. And if we can't afford our own homes, that's a real problem. And suggesting that I should move to Port Talbot, buy a cheap house and live on the minimum wage is completely stupid.

looknohands

I actually agree with you with regards to the thread, don't move to Port Talbot.

I just thought it was an extremely ignorant point you made that you were more economically valuable than another citizen based on the amount of income tax you'd paid, economic value does not correlate to tax paid (eg. CEO of massively failed banks)

Up until that point I was nodding along to everything you said... carry on

littlegreenfrog_2

looknohands wrote: »

I actually agree with you with regards to the thread, don't move to Port Talbot.

I just thought it was an extremely ignorant point you made that you were more economically valuable than another citizen based on the amount of income tax you'd paid, economic value does not correlate to tax paid (eg. CEO of massively failed banks)

Up until that point I was nodding along to everything you said... carry on

I still think you're misinterpreting me. I think I am more economically valuable doing what I currently do than I would be if I chucked it all in and went to do a minimum wage job. People in general are more economically valuable if they do a job which is appropriate to their education and skills. And the taxpayer helped to subsidise my higher education, so if I went to work in Tesco or in a bar somewhere, that would not be a very good return on the taxpayer's investment. The same cannot be said for most people who work in Tesco or in a bar as their main or permanent job and have not undergone a huge amount of training to do something else. Although they do, obviously, make a valuable contribution to the economy, and I would agree that they are more economically valuable than the CEO of a failed bank!

always_sunny

looknohands wrote: »

I guess if you don't care about public healthcare you could just argue that London will survive on private healthcare, close the NHS hospitals... wouldn't want poor people to be encouraged to live there :rotfl:

I care about those who need it and may not afford it so I have private health insurance.
I am used to countries where no health insurance = 1~1.5% tax surcharge on your tax...

always_sunny

littlegreenfrog wrote: »

I have a bachelor's degree, two professional postgraduate qualifications and will soon have a master's degree on top of that (currently studying part-time whilst working). I am currently using my education and ability in a job which is appropriate to my skills and experience, paying off my student loan, paying my taxes and generally putting more into the economy than I am taking out.

And? Isn't London like the highest concentration of graduates like 60% of the workforce? You are lucky to be working in an industry and subject you studied and enjoy. Many are not so lucky. I don't believe though it should have any correlation to housing.

littlegreenfrog wrote: »

I think I am more economically valuable doing what I currently do than I would be if I chucked it all in and went to do a minimum wage job. People in general are more economically valuable if they do a job which is appropriate to their education and skills.!

That I agree - you're renting and more likely subsidising someone's pension given that many previous generations did not have a scheme.
With all these degree holders the UK (and most industrialised countries) are baking makes you think what next generation would do.

Thrugelmir

Boler1985 wrote: »

But say a person in there early 20s now probably is going to struggle more than before, especially in London?

Years back wasn't any easy. As many areas you wouldn't want to live in London. The "nice" parts were always expensive in relative terms.