Are there any reasons why I should avoid cars with turbo 3 cylinder engines?

s_b

we have one of these pewgots in our family circle,its now 5 months old and sounds like a peace of crap once the revs raise and you can clearly tell its a 3 pot wonder
these cars like all these overstressed pieces of yuk are all fine whilst under manufacturers warranty,after that then you just know they are going to suck money in repairs

Mobeer

Autocar did a nice review of various 3 cylinder engines, including the question of balance raised above:
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/comparison-three-cylinder-engines-test

BMW, Ford come out on top
Peugeot-Citroën, Vauxhall trailed behind
Renault did worst

Idomeneus

bigjl wrote: »

Do you understand the difference between a CVT auto and the Autobox fitted to the 208, which Inwould suspect is probably the usual PSA automated manual.

Why would the revs be different at 30mph and 60/70mph?

The gearbox would simply be in a different gear, which is what AdrianC was getting at when he said the box would select the most efficient gear.

Which at 30mph might be 3rd or 4th and at 60/70mph might be 5th or even 6th if the box has 6gears.

A CVT hasn't really got any "gears" there might be set positions that the engine may default to, but the actual ratios will be constantly variable.

Hence why if you hit the throttle pedal for max acceleration it simply revs to a higher amount and maintains it with the box altering the ratios as road speed increases. If you lift off in a CVT the revs will drop quickly.

I personally don't like driving CVT boxes that much as they are pretty noisy.

The Jazz is also one of the worst Autos on the market mainly due to the CVT box.

Yes, I'm a technical person. I understand the difference between a CVT and a conventional automatic gearbox. But thank you for asking.

By "PSA automated manual", I assume you are referring to an automated "bolt on" to a manual gearbox? If that is the case, I don't believe the Peugeot 208 that I drove had such a gearbox. The one I drove had a 1.2L PureTech 110 EAT6 S&S engine, and I was assured by the Peugeot sales exec that the new EAT6 gearbox is a conventional type of automatic gearbox and not a "bolt-on" to a manual gearbox.

I've driven my Honda CVT Jazz for 12 years now and, recently, I have test driven a Peugeot 208 and a Volkswagen Polo. The Polo had a 4 cylinder engine with a conventional automatic gearbox, or so I was assured by the Volkswagen sales exec. On both my Jazz and the Polo, when I drive at a constant speed of 30mph, the rpm dial displays about 1500rpm and, when I drive at a constant speed of 60/70mph, the rpm dial displays about 2500rpm. It was only on the Peugeot 208 did the rpm dial display about 2500rpm for both speeds. That is why I was wondering whether the fact that the Peugeot 208 had a turbo 3 cylinder engine had anything to do with the difference in behaviour.

Regarding your comments on the CVT and the Jazz, I guess it is a matter of personal preference. Over the 12 years that I have owned a CVT Jazz, I have found the car and the gearbox to be brilliant. And, considering the popularity of the Jazz, many others probably feel the same way. I'm prepared to admit though that it is far from being a "sporty" car and is not for those who like to "race from the blocks".

xHannahx

What level of mileage are you doing? How long do you intend keeping it? What kind of driving do you do?
Longer term it will have a shorter life span, due to extra strain on small engines but your potentially still looking at 10-15 years life time.
If your doing low speed, low miles I don't see there being a problem. If your doing high speed, high miles I would steer away.

Idomeneus

xHannahx wrote: »

What level of mileage are you doing? How long do you intend keeping it? What kind of driving do you do?

With my current, aging Honda CVT Jazz, I've done 147,000 miles in 12 years - that's an average of 12,250 miles per year.

Normally, I would not plan to keep a car for more than 10 years. I've kept my current car a little longer because I was waiting for the third generation Jazz to appear in the UK. Unfortunately, that turned out to be a little disappointing, which is the reason why I am now looking around to determine whether any other supermini satisfies our requirements better.

I do a mixture of driving - town, country roads and motorways. We take our car to the Continent quite frequently. Our current car has been to France, Italy, Spain, Germany, Belgium and Switzerland. Generally, I keep to 70mph or below on motorways, even in countries like France where you can drive up to 130kph (approx. 81mph) on motorways.

According to your criteria, it sounds a bit borderline as to whether I should take a chance on a turbo 3 cylinder engine. Yes?

securityguy

" I have test driven a Peugeot 208 and a Volkswagen Polo. The Polo had a 4 cylinder engine with a conventional automatic gearbox"

I'd be surprised if that were true, unless it was quite considerably second-hand. All the automatic Mk 5 Polos (2008 onwards) are DSG, so any Polo with a conventional automatic (ie with a torque convertor) would be at least eight years old.

Idomeneus

securityguy wrote: »

" I have test driven a Peugeot 208 and a Volkswagen Polo. The Polo had a 4 cylinder engine with a conventional automatic gearbox"

I'd be surprised if that were true, unless it was quite considerably second-hand. All the automatic Mk 5 Polos (2008 onwards) are DSG, so any Polo with a conventional automatic (ie with a torque convertor) would be at least eight years old.

I've asked this question on another thread in this forum but have received no reply.

I was under the impression that there are 3 basic types of automatic gearbox: a CVT (as in the Jazz - and in the Yaris now, I believe), an automated "bolt-on" to a manual gearbox (e.g. the i-shift on some older Jazzes), and a conventional automatic gearbox with a torque converter. Now, a DSG is not a CVT, and I am assured by the Volkswagen sales exec that it is not an automated "bolt-on" to a manual gearbox. So, if it is not a conventional automatic gearbox, what is it?

Later edit: I apologise. I have just found this article on Wikipedia which explains what a DSG is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct-shift_gearbox.

AdrianC

DSG - two manual gearboxes strapped together with far too many electronics.

securityguy

AdrianC wrote: »

DSG - two manual gearboxes strapped together with far too many electronics.

Have you actually driven one, then? I've got one I've had for 120k trouble free miles, and it's absolutely fantastic. I've owned a range of autos, both torque converters and CVT, and it's not quite as smooth as either of those, but it's better on fuel. The 7 speed dry plate one in a petrol I was in recently (mine's the 6 speed wet plate in a diesel) seemed even better, and is certainly lighter.

The electronics thing is a complete red herring: the electronics are no more complex than the ECU that every car has, and certainly less complex than the electronics, sensors and actuators involved in a stability control system that is now universal on any car fitted with DSG. If anything is going to fail in a DSG by dint of its complexity it's going to be mechanical, because there's a lot of stuff in the case and the lubrication is quite complex. I suspect that mine is starting to show slight signs of wear on the 1-3-5 clutch, for example.

xHannahx

Idomeneus wrote: »

According to your criteria, it sounds a bit borderline as to whether I should take a chance on a turbo 3 cylinder engine. Yes?

I would be sceptical, depended on the brand as well looking at ebay and auto trader at 10 year old 3 cylinders.
Look at 10-12 year old 3 cylinder non turbo and the only ones about with higher mileage are VAG group cars.
There are barely any 10 year old 107/C1 with more than 80-90k. There are many Vag 3 cylinders with 160k advertised.

This tells one of two tales, either some 3 cylinders aren't up for big miles, or owners of certain brand 3 cylinders don't do much mileage and other brand owners do.

A turbo will make a small difference but they have quite large turbos i believe which could create its own problems.