Vent - My Mother (and her generation?)

gettingtheresometime

I haven't read the whole thread but surely the things that are better or worse are things that politicians have implimented?

Lack of social housing - RTB has had a massive impact on this, gender equality has only been brought about by legislation not the philanthropy of employers, uni fees again introduced by politicians not implemented unilaterally by unis.

Or am I missing the point?

Cornucopia

It's a big mix of factors - political, economic, social, technological....

missbiggles1

gettingtheresometime wrote: »

I haven't read the whole thread but surely the things that are better or worse are things that politicians have implimented?

Lack of social housing - RTB has had a massive impact on this, gender equality has only been brought about by legislation not the philanthropy of employers, uni fees again introduced by politicians not implemented unilaterally by unis.

Or am I missing the point?

But who votes in the politicians and their policies?

mumps

Person_one wrote: »

But there's no argument that if you're looking at the broad trend over the last 50 years, housing (both owned and rented) has got less affordable for ordinary people. Surely nobody can be arguing that rents and house prices are lower compared to wages than they were in 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95 or even 2000? There was a dip after the crash of 2007/8 but not enough to really bring anything down to a sensible level.

I am not saying prices haven't gone up but you can make the picture look better or worse by picking where you start and end. The example of I think it was someone's uncle buying in 1970 just before a boom gives a different picture to someone buying pretty well at the peak of the boom in 1973.

Affordability comes into it as well, we were paying much higher income tax, 33% I think so take home pay was probably lower than people think and interest rates alot higher. I know people always say that didn't last long but of course we had no way of knowing that.

I don't think it helps if people aren't willing to look at the bigger picture.

pollypenny

The housing market, as well as prices, has changed enormously, making it difficult to compare.

I posted about the different 'finishes', but BTL has had a huge impact, with competition for property especially at the bottom end of the market.

I also wonder about the ease of remortgaging. Does that encourage further debt and price inflation or not?

In general people have higher expectations, too, what ever their ages. As young marrieds we weren't tempted by fancy technology. However, the landline and its calls were dear enough.

pollypenny

mumps wrote: »

I am not saying prices haven't gone up but you can make the picture look better or worse by picking where you start and end. The example of I think it was someone's uncle buying in 1970 just before a boom gives a different picture to someone buying pretty well at the peak of the boom in 1973.

Affordability comes into it as well, we were paying much higher income tax, 33% I think so take home pay was probably lower than people think and interest rates alot higher. I know people always say that didn't last long but of course we had no way of knowing that.

I don't think it helps if people aren't willing to look at the bigger picture.

I think 7 - 8% was the average interest rate for years, with a period at 10 and the nightmare of 15%.

MIRAS was a real help in the early years, was phased out just after we bought this 'fixer-upper'. And VAT became payable on home improvements weeks after we moved in. No loyalty cards and discounts, either.

mumps

fierystormcloud wrote: »

You're right, there IS no argument.

For some reason, several posters here just ain't getting it.

I am struggling to make sense of what 'mumps' is actually on about: 'choosing starting and end dates?' 'picking before price booms yada yada....' !!!!!!? I have not chosen any start or end dates, and neither has 'person one' or anyone else.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that a house that cost £5K in 1970, should be worth about £75K now if you take inflation into account, but that SAME house is worth around £280 to £300K. PROVING that house prices have tripled-(some have even quadrupled! And then some!)

On the other hand, wages in the early 70s were say £1.15 an hour, (for basic pay,) and if you take inflation into account, basic pay should be around £18 to £20 an hour. But it's NOT; it's around £7 an hour! So no wonder people struggle financially these days.)

It's really really easy and really really obvious. (Well to me, and anyone with any logic and common sense!)

I think we could sit here til the cows come home and try to explain it, and because they don't 'get it,' they will dig their heels in and crow about how we are cherry picking statistics, with a chorus of 'yeah buts' and 'no buts,' and a handful of nonsensical reasons why we are 'wrong.'

You couldn't make it up!

I work with people like this. It's an ongoing battle some days! :rotfl:

I'm done on here. I can't keep repeating myself to people who JUST. DON'T. GET. IT.

I'm sorry that you don't understand how statistics can be used and manipulated. I am also sorry that I wasn't earning £1.15 an hour in the early 70s, 55p an hour was more like it but of course men earned more but again as a serving police officer my husband wasn't earning that.

You know someone who earned a certain amount in 1970 or paid a certain amount for a house but it doesn't mean everyone did. Would you like to tell us what job the person was doing who earned £1.15 an hour because lots of us seemed to miss out.

Some people are earning NMW in 2016, I retired a few months ago on roughly £40 an hour so in 50 years time would it be right to say in 2016 people earned £6.50 an hour or £40 an hour? I know people who are on more than £100 an hour so that confuses it even more.

mumps

Redlady..... wrote: »

Most families were able to live on the man's wage. Usually the woman went out to work for 'pin money', a part time job which was usually for holidays and any other extras that might be wanted.

Through the 60's and 70's there was also a Prices and Incomes Policy
which was used to control directly the rate of increase of wages and prices.

I never worked for pin money and nor did any of my friends, we worked to pay the mortgage.

mumps

pollypenny wrote: »

The housing market, as well as prices, has changed enormously, making it difficult to compare.

I posted about the different 'finishes', but BTL has had a huge impact, with competition for property especially at the bottom end of the market.

I also wonder about the ease of remortgaging. Does that encourage further debt and price inflation or not?

In general people have higher expectations, too, what ever their ages. As young marrieds we weren't tempted by fancy technology. However, the landline and its calls were dear enough.

I think the remortgaging to release equity has got harder in recent years, from what I've heard anyway, but I think it must have contributed to alot of spending and inflation.

Redlady.....

mumps wrote: »

I never worked for pin money and nor did any of my friends, we worked to pay the mortgage.

No-one I knew had a mortgage in the 60's, and most families lived off the fathers wage for the most part.