UKPC parking notice on 6.2.16

chrisso50

Reposted here as a new thread, as advised. I have now been advised not to ignore the notice ...

<<I got a UKPC parking notice on 6.2.16 demanding a £100 parking charge. The vehicle was left at a retail park for no longer than the 90 mins limit period stated on the sign in the car park. The UKPC ticket says it was placed on the windscreen within 1 minute of parking there. It says "vehicle owner/driver left site". Amazingly, whether or not you visit the shops at the site a charge is made if you leave the site without leaving in the car. Friends advise me 'ignore' the notice. Is this still current/good advice? >>

beamerguy

chrisso50 wrote: »

Reposted here as a new thread, as advised. I have now been advised not to ignore the notice ...

<<I got a UKPC parking notice on 6.2.16 demanding a £100 parking charge. The vehicle was left at a retail park for no longer than the 90 mins limit period stated on the sign in the car park. The UKPC ticket says it was placed on the windscreen within 1 minute of parking there. It says "vehicle owner/driver left site". Amazingly, whether or not you visit the shops at the site a charge is made if you leave the site without leaving in the car. Friends advise me 'ignore' the notice. Is this still current/good advice? >>

OK great, as said on your previous post

UKPC over and over again. Do not pay, do not ignore, that is the current advice so please tell your friends.
You need to have a read of the Newbies thread
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822

You need pictures of your claim. UKPC need to provide pictures as proof ...... WATCH THEM THOUGH, they doctor pictures

Coupon-mad

chrisso50 wrote: »

Reposted here as a new thread, as advised. I have now been advised not to ignore the notice ...

<<I got a UKPC parking notice on 6.2.16 demanding a £100 parking charge. The vehicle was left at a retail park for no longer than the 90 mins limit period stated on the sign in the car park. The UKPC ticket says it was placed on the windscreen within 1 minute of parking there. It says "vehicle owner/driver left site". Amazingly, whether or not you visit the shops at the site a charge is made if you leave the site without leaving in the car. Friends advise me 'ignore' the notice. Is this still current/good advice? >>

Once you have read post #1 of the NEWBIES thread you will have the first appeal to use (blue writing) around day 26. Put that in UKPC's appeal page online and ONLY describe yourself as 'registered keeper' (assuming you are). The sticky thread explains not to imply who parked the car. Do not talk about whether the driver left the site at this stage.

Then come back when UKPC eventually send a rejection letter in March (quite possibly after a desperate email or letter wanting to know who was driving - ignore that one, a rejection will follow it if you remain silent!). At POPLA stage, post #3 of the NEWBIES thread shows you winning words; our long detailed appeals from registered keepers do work.

And you will be able to use the argument that there can be no keeper liability because UKPC will have forgotten to issue a NTK.

Herzlos

Ask them to prove the driver (unnamed) left the site, to prove that is part of the contract, on top of all of the usual points.

I'd also send a complaint to the BPA about them managing to stick a ticket on a car for leaving the site within 1 minute of parking; even if a passenger left the site, the ticket was probably on the car before they'd got to the boundary and that is very clearly a predatory practice.

Redx

small typo in post #3 above,

its post #1 of the NEWBIES thread you start with, using the BPA template letter in blue text and send around day 25 or 26 as keeper (no admitting who was driving)

then its post #3 of that same thread when you get a popla code after any rejection of your appeal

also complain to the BPA as mentioned above

[EMAIL="aos&#64;britishparking.co.uk"]aos@britishparking.co.uk[/EMAIL]

its up to 10 minutes grace at the start of a parking period , so the 1 minute is not good enough, especially as UKPC have been fraudulently doctoring photos and using predatory practices and been banned from the DVLA database and sanctioned by the BPA too

chrisso50

Thanks for the replies. Should I log in to the UKPC website to view their photographic evidence as their ticket suggests?

The parking sign says "Retail Park User Only 90 Minute Maximum Stay." Underneath, in smaller lettering: "This land is private property. If you leave this site whilst your vehicle remains in this car park you will be liable to receive a parking charge notice." Can UKPC claim that 'if it was on a notice you agree to those terms'?

I wrote to one of the companies at the retail park to complain. This was their reply:
"Thank you for your recent email regarding the parking fine you have received at our xxx store. I am sorry to hear that you have received this.
The xxx branch is rented from a private landlord who has an agreement with the company in question to monitor the car park and unfortunately, xxx [company] do not have any authority over this. The parking company claim that the parking restrictions are clearly signposted around the car park and give clear indication of the restrictions in place.

xxx can only apologise for any inconvenience this has caused you but we are unable to assist you with this matter any further.

Kind Regards
xxx
xxx Customer Service Team

My response -

"Thank you for your reply. But I'm sorry, you are a commercial enterprise. It does your store and the company name no credit to acquiesce in such an underhand arrangement with UKPC. Customers like me visit your store and see a sign that says 90 mins free parking limit. To use your store and then be told that because we walked away from the parking area - for 20 minutes! - unawares of the small print on the sign - we have to pay a HUGE penalty does your company no credit. We did not overstay the 90 mins limit, we obeyed the sign. Pay and display would be a fairer arrangement.

"So be sure that everyone in this family - 17 of us got together at the weekend - is now going to publicise this far and wide, on TV and in the press as well as on social media. You may like to inform xxxx HQ that you will lose custom as a result, not just at xxx but elsewhere. Incredible. We cannot be the first to fall foul of this mean trick and surely won't be the last. Your company needs to consider its position. "

Herzlos

chrisso50 wrote: »

Thanks for the replies. Should I log in to the UKPC website to view their photographic evidence as their ticket suggests?

It won't hurt if you do. Be very careful if there are any forms though.

The parking sign says "Retail Park User Only 90 Minute Maximum Stay." Underneath, in smaller lettering: "This land is private property. If you leave this site whilst your vehicle remains in this car park you will be liable to receive a parking charge notice." Can UKPC claim that 'if it was on a notice you agree to those terms'?

Have you got a photo of the sign and it's location? If it's not readable or against the BPA code of practice, then they can't hold you to a contract you didn't agree to.

I'd argue the sign is misleading; is "your vehicle" the one you drove in? Is it still yours if someone else owns it?
Who is you? the driver? the passengers? What if there are 4 of you and 1 of you leaves the site?

Since the wording is clearly a breach, the attendant clearly has a duty to try and mitigate - they should have warned you against leaving the site. They should also put up signage on the boundary of the site warning against leaving, but they did neither. Why? Because they want you to leave the site in order to try and charge you £100. That's called entrapment.

Well done for having a pop at the store as well; they need to know that fobbing you off on the parking company is not going to work, and being involved with these scum will cost them in the long run.

Why did one or more of the occupants leave the site? Are there other stores nearby or a cash machine or something?

If it's for other stores, it's maybe worth checking with the council planning department if the planning permission was granted on the premise that the car park was to be made available for other stores in the town (very common). If so, the signs are a breach and you can complain to everyone (council, BPA, DVLA, store) about it.

If it's for a cash machine, you can mention that to the store "whilst visiting a cash machine to pay for goods in your store, I was mugged by UKPC".

Redx

and please get your group, family and friends to sign this Beavis petition, to try to get some common sense back into this sc@m industry

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/111925

Coupon-mad

I always suggest everyone view the UKPC photos because their picture of their sign is invariably soooo useful to use as POPLA evidence later! Unreadable pale sign up a 9 - foot high pole, where the £100 is illegible as are the so called contract terms. A screenshot of the page, suitably enlarged then cropped to show only the sign photo, fits very nicely in your word document at POPLA stage in the 'unclear signage' point.

fisherjim

This is just another example of how the minimum wage supplemented by bonus schemes attracts shady tactics by PPC employees, absolutely despicable.
If people leaving site is so detrimental to the operation of the car park or businesses it serves why didn't the Muppet PPC employee go up to the occupant and point it out, rather than hiding in the shadows until the unsuspecting person moved towards the boundary, allegedly!

chrisso50

Sorry about this - my original post was on 8.2.16 [see top of page].
· Parking penalty ticket 6.2.16. Headed 'Vehicle Owner/driver left site.' Demands £100 payment or £60 if paid within 14 days.
· Letter from UKPC to reg keeper arrived 16.3.16. Headed 'Vehicle owner/driver left site.' Demands £100 payment.
· FINAL REMINDER letter from UKPC to reg keeper dated 29.3.16 (date of receipt not recorded). Headed 'Vehicle owner/driver left site.' Demands £100 payment.
· Letter from Debt Recovery Plus Ltd to reg keeper dated 14.4.16 (date of receipt not recorded). Headed 'Demand for Payment of Unpaid Parking Charge £160'. Written by 'Collections Manager.' Refers to 'landmark court decision by Supreme Court 4 Nov 2015'. Says payment must be made by 28.4.16.
· Letter from Debt Recovery Plus Ltd to reg keeper dated 29.4.16 (date of receipt 6.5.16). Headed 'Notice of Intended Court Action – unpaid parking charge £160’. Written by 'Litigation Manager.' Says payment must be made by 13.5.16 or file will be passed to UKPC with a recommendation to commence court action and will seek to recover additional amounts for court fees and solicitor’s costs.
· Letter from Debt Recovery Plus Ltd to reg keeper dated 16.5.16 (date of receipt 20.5.16). Headed ‘Reduced payment offer of £136 to avoid court proceedings.’ It adds ‘pay us no later than 30 May’ and ‘This is our final offer. If you are liable for this charge and do not pay the amount will go back to the full amount of £160 and the matter will be referred back to the creditor to consider commencing court proceedings. A county court judgment against you could affect your ability to obtain credit.’

I attempted today to do something about this, having been busy till now. I tried to check the 'photographic evidence' that UKPC claim 'may also be viewed' at their website (on back of orginal ticket left on windscreen). No joy - the website said when I sought to access it - "Unfortunately we are unable to accept this Appeal as the Parking Charge Reference number has now been referred to our Debt Recovery Team. We request that you discuss the matter directly with them by telephone 0208 234 6775.'.

Have I left this too late? I seem to be too late for a POPLA appeal. Should I write to the Debt Recovery Team? If so what is best for me to say?

Thanks for any advice.