USA travel denied?

headpin

Bond,James_Bond wrote: »

I don't think not having a TV licence involves moral turpitude

By whose definition? I bet the US authorities would put defrauding a public body under the same category as mass homocide? Or am I becoming paranoid!

Bond,James_Bond

headpin wrote: »

By whose definition? I bet the US authorities would put defrauding a public body under the same category as mass homocide? Or am I becoming paranoid!

The ESTA guidance says:

resulting in serious damage to property, or serious harm to another person or government authority (these types of offences were previously referred to as crimes of moral turpitude)

the cost of a TV licence is hardly "serious harm".

force_ten

in US law

Crimes involving moral turpitude are grouped into three general categories. They are: (1) Crimes committed against property (for example, arson, blackmail, burglary, larceny, robbery, fraud, false pretences, theft, receiving stolen property); (2) crimes committed against governmental authority (for example, bribery, tax evasion, perjury, fraud against government functions); and (3) crimes committed against persons, family relationships, and sexual morality (for example, serious assaults, gross indecency, lewdness, kidnapping, contributing to the delinquency of a minor, murder, voluntary manslaughter, rape).

in the eyes of US law theft is a crime involving moral turpitude, so for immigration purposes anybody with a conviction for petty theft or theft is not eligible to travel to the US using the ESTA visa waiver program

right or wrong the US embassy will say if you have a conviction for petty theft then you need a visa to travel to the USA

force_ten

Bond,James_Bond wrote: »

I don't think not having a TV licence involves moral turpitude

I would agree with you on that one and if i was in that situation i would tick no to the question about convictions

but if you contacted the US Embassy in london and asked the question i suspect their answer would be that you do have to apply for a visa due to the conviction

Voyager2002

force_ten wrote: »

but if you contacted the US Embassy in london and asked the question i suspect their answer would be that you do have to apply for a visa due to the conviction

Their answer is always yes: they do not tell you that there is no visa required for crimes that definitely do not involve "moral turpitude" and so will not discuss whether any crime does or does not involve it. Perhaps they pocket some of the visa fees.

force_ten

there has always been massive confusion over what crimes do involve moral turpitude and what crimes do not, also the fact that moral turpitude is not commonly used in UK law many people have never heard of it and have no idea what it means

in the case of the TV licence evasion i would say although you went to court and received a conviction it would be classed as a non recordable conviction so should not appear on the PNC

Exemplar

Update. I went to the embassy 27/01 and declared that, in 1986, I had been arrested and fined. They knew that as well as a traffic violation in 1998 and an arrest (a case of mistaken identity) in 2000.

I have been permanently excluded from entering the US. I have appealed and it takes 6 months for this to be processed.

So this is my warning to you all who believe that you can bypass the system. They know, they have your information.

I'm sure that the usual people will now say 'well I got away with it' or 'they cannot know'. Well they just did.

Voyager2002

Exemplar wrote: »

Update. I went to the embassy 27/01 and declared that, in 1986, I had been arrested and fined. They knew that as well as a traffic violation in 1998 and an arrest (a case of mistaken identity) in 2000.

I have been permanently excluded from entering the US. I have appealed and it takes 6 months for this to be processed.

So this is my warning to you all who believe that you can bypass the system. They know, they have your information.

I'm sure that the usual people will now say 'well I got away with it' or 'they cannot know'. Well they just did.

Did they know before you told them?

Magnolia

Well obviously such a hardened criminal such as yourself has to be excluded!!! :mad:

I just don't get them! You can live there and buy guns to go and kill anyone you like but commit a minor crime 20 years ago - must be a bad-un! *shakes head in wonder*

With all the gun toting nutters around USA maybe you are better off not going there - perhaps everyone should take that stance and maybe they will see just how ridiculous they are!

Exemplar

Voyager2002 wrote: »

Did they know before you told them?

Yes. They questioned me.