Debate House Prices


In order to help keep the Forum a useful, safe and friendly place for our users, discussions around non MoneySaving matters are no longer permitted. This includes wider debates about general house prices, the economy and politics. As a result, we have taken the decision to keep this board permanently closed, but it remains viewable for users who may find some useful information in it. Thank you for your understanding.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!

Inside ISIS Inc

Generali
Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
edited 2 December 2015 at 11:43AM in Debate House Prices & the Economy
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/baad34e4-973c-11e5-9228-87e603d47bdc.html#axzz3t2NFgFsb
As a known arms dealer for rebels fighting Isis in his east Syrian home town, Abu Ali was sure his days were numbered when, a year ago, two jihadi commanders stepped out of their pickup truck and walked towards him. He was baffled when they handed him a printed paper. “It read, ‘This person is permitted to buy and sell all types of weaponry inside the Islamic State,’” recalls Abu Ali. “It was even stamped ‘Mosul Centre’.”
«1345

Comments

  • Mistermeaner
    Mistermeaner Posts: 3,024 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts
    probably more economically literate than the SNP
    Left is never right but I always am.
  • vivatifosi
    vivatifosi Posts: 18,746 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Mortgage-free Glee! PPI Party Pooper
    Thanks for starting this thread Gen. There is so much about the economics of the so called Caliphate that I would like to know and this is a really interesting start.

    Other things I'd like to know are:

    Who is buying the oil?
    Are they being bankrolled from outside and is that at a state level?
    Do shops, restaurants, factories etc still function as normal?
    Is it like living in a brutal yet functioning country, or more like living under the !!!!!, with a huge black economy and protection money paid?
    What percentage of their GDP do they spend on their military?
    Please stay safe in the sun and learn the A-E of melanoma: A = asymmetry, B = irregular borders, C= different colours, D= diameter, larger than 6mm, E = evolving, is your mole changing? Most moles are not cancerous, any doubts, please check next time you visit your GP.
  • vivatifosi
    vivatifosi Posts: 18,746 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Mortgage-free Glee! PPI Party Pooper
    Please stay safe in the sun and learn the A-E of melanoma: A = asymmetry, B = irregular borders, C= different colours, D= diameter, larger than 6mm, E = evolving, is your mole changing? Most moles are not cancerous, any doubts, please check next time you visit your GP.
  • princeofpounds
    princeofpounds Posts: 10,396 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    Who is buying the oil?
    Turkey mostly, but it's rather indirect. It's not the state buying, but there is a network of traders who basically bring it over the border and mix it into more legitimate trading systems. From there, it ends up everywhere, but mostly in Turkish domestic consumption. There is nothing special about Turkey really, it's just the route that is open.
    Are they being bankrolled from outside and is that at a state level?
    Not so much these days. They found a big stack of cash (literally) in the Mosul Central Bank which was abandoned - the Iraqi state still has to operate largely on a cash basis. Hundreds of millions of dollars if you believe the press (I have no idea). They also have the oil production, and sell antiquities. (Edit: and extract trade/road tolls and extortion)


    If they are getting any external help, it is mostly in terms of open trading routes. There was some sympathy from Sunni populations in the region (Turkey, West Iraq directly, places like Saudi less directly) at the outset, but I think they exhausted a lot of goodwill.
    Do shops, restaurants, factories etc still function as normal?
    In some areas the local economy functions fairly normally. You can still get a can of coca cola in the market for example. But where there is fighting it all falls apart.
    Is it like living in a brutal yet functioning country, or more like living under the !!!!!, with a huge black economy and protection money paid?
    The two main cities have the trappings of a state - out on the road and in the towns and villages I think it tends to be much more wild west.
    What percentage of their GDP do they spend on their military?
    no idea sorry.
  • antrobus
    antrobus Posts: 17,386 Forumite
    vivatifosi wrote: »
    ...Who is buying the oil?....

    There is an established black market for oil in Iraq. Once the oil is refined it just disappears into the market.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2014/08/18/business/al-khatteeb-isis-oil-iraq/
    vivatifosi wrote: »
    ...Are they being bankrolled from outside and is that at a state level?...

    Initially, yes. The funding came from wealthy individuals in other ME states, but no state level funding I think. Unless you count the ransoms that Spain and France handed over.
    vivatifosi wrote: »
    ....Do shops, restaurants, factories etc still function as normal?...

    As normal as you can get in a state of permanent war.
    vivatifosi wrote: »
    ...Is it like living in a brutal yet functioning country, or more like living under the !!!!!, with a huge black economy and protection money paid?......

    I think it's more like living under that well known organised crime organisation whose name is for some reason not allowed here in MSEland. But Islamic State appear to have a very effective tax collection system. The penalty for non payment is death.
    vivatifosi wrote: »
    ..What percentage of their GDP do they spend on their military?

    I don't believe that Islamic State has got round to establishing its own version of the ONS. So I expect the answer would be 'nobody knows'.
  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    vivatifosi wrote: »

    Interesting piece if you can get past the pejorative language. I love how they talk about what happens to people that don't pay up. What does the NYT think happens to people that don't pay their taxes in the UK or US? To couch it in the same terms......



    ....in the UK, people are expect to give up to half their income or even more to the self-styled 'Head of the Church of England' through her hated 'HMRC'. HMRC has the power to break in to people's homes at will and can seize property and even throw dissenters of the so-called taxation system into prison.

    This system of taxation is based on the ancient Christian idea of tithing where the faithful were expected to give 10% of their money to local theocratic rulers. In the C21st, these fundamentalists demand far, far more to pay for wars and to distribute among supporters.
  • Sapphire
    Sapphire Posts: 4,269 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Debt-free and Proud!
    Why even give space for this psychopathic, murdering, pae*do. filth?
  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Sapphire wrote: »
    Why even give space for this psychopathic, murdering, pae*do. filth?

    Because I'm interested in how their economy works. Aren't you?
  • Sapphire
    Sapphire Posts: 4,269 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Debt-free and Proud!
    Generali wrote: »
    Because I'm interested in how their economy works. Aren't you?

    No – because 'their' 'economy' consists of what they've looted and pillaged from others, while murdering people in the most horrific way.

    What I am interested in is knowing what countries and individuals collaborate with them by buying the things they've obtained by such methods, whether it's oil (e.g. Turkey) or antiquities.
  • purch
    purch Posts: 9,865 Forumite
    Generali wrote: »
    Because I'm interested in how their economy works.

    If we want to defeat them we need to understand them.
    'In nature, there are neither rewards nor punishments - there are Consequences.'
This discussion has been closed.
Meet your Ambassadors

🚀 Getting Started

Hi new member!

Our Getting Started Guide will help you get the most out of the Forum

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 351.3K Banking & Borrowing
  • 253.2K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 453.7K Spending & Discounts
  • 244.2K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 599.4K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 177.1K Life & Family
  • 257.7K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 16.2K Discuss & Feedback
  • 37.6K Read-Only Boards

Is this how you want to be seen?

We see you are using a default avatar. It takes only a few seconds to pick a picture.