Final meter reading given to new supplier they used estimate instead

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

twokcc wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies.
I was moving from a fixed deal with the coop so difference is only small.
It is just so frustrating that EON could get this wrong- whats a system error? in particular when I have spent a lot of time trying to get a correct final bill from the coop. If I had known about the error it would have saved me sending a strongly worded e-mail to the coop about their abysmal customer service culminating in not even being able to get the final gas reading correct.
Now had to go back at aplogise, so eon if you do this to customers (use wrong opening meter readings) have the decency to advise them. Maybe not everyone checks that their energy supplier bills are correct.
After being with Npower, Scottish Power and Coop I would be £100's out of pocket if I'd accepted that they only issued correct bills!!!

Hi twokcc

I'm sorry we've caused you frustration by not using your opening gas reading. I suspect Hengus is spot on and the third party we use to validate readings when a supply switches has given us a different reading. As Hengus says, provided both the gaining and losing suppliers use the same reading, charges won't be duplicated.

I'll certainly pass your comments on to the relevant areas. Feedback like this is crucial when looking at how we communicate with our customers so thank you for posting. Thanks also to Hengus for an excellent explanation.

Malc

Rubidium

E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc wrote: »

Hi twokcc

I'm sorry we've caused you frustration by not using your opening gas reading. I suspect Hengus is spot on and the third party we use to validate readings when a supply switches has given us a different reading. As Hengus says, provided both the gaining and losing suppliers use the same reading, charges won't be duplicated.

I'll certainly pass your comments on to the relevant areas. Feedback like this is crucial when looking at how we communicate with our customers so thank you for posting. Thanks also to Hengus for an excellent explanation.

Malc

How long has it been common practise for suppliers to "use a third party to validate readings" when a customer switches supply?

This causes problems if they base their estimate on previous usage for a property. What if the property is now empty etc. There are many reasons that the usage may be different now.

I have experienced this silly game that suppliers now play twice recently - an estimated final reading that I refuse to pay as accurate readings were given and an estimated start reading when switching suppliers on another property. They all seem to be at it now, this achieves nothing except customer dissatisfaction and unnecessary frustration!

naedanger

cameltoe wrote: »

How long has it been common practise for suppliers to "use a third party to validate readings" when a customer switches supply?

This causes problems if they base their estimate on previous usage for a property. What if the property is now empty etc. There are many reasons that the usage may be different now.

I have experienced this silly game that suppliers now play twice recently - an estimated final reading that I refuse to pay as accurate readings were given and an estimated start reading when switching suppliers on another property. They all seem to be at it now, this achieves nothing except customer dissatisfaction and unnecessary frustration!

Questions aimed at E.On

Just to elaborate slightly on the above, I think the key point is how long has this (i.e. using an industry estimate) been common practice when the customer has given an accurate reading?

And what right have companies to do this e.g. contractual or overriding legislation?

I can understand companies may query customer readings but in those circumstances should they not at least attempt to take their own actual reading before using an estimate?

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

Shrimply wrote: »

No no, you are totally right. I'm sorry. I did the calculations quickly using my own spreadsheet and failed to remove the correction for an imperial meter even though I thought I had. Hence my £20 was about 3x too high.

Thanks Shrimply. Must admit, wasn't totally sure when I posted so thanks again for clearing this up.

Malc

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

cameltoe wrote: »

How long has it been common practise for suppliers to "use a third party to validate readings" when a customer switches supply?

This causes problems if they base their estimate on previous usage for a property. What if the property is now empty etc. There are many reasons that the usage may be different now.

I have experienced this silly game that suppliers now play twice recently - an estimated final reading that I refuse to pay as accurate readings were given and an estimated start reading when switching suppliers on another property. They all seem to be at it now, this achieves nothing except customer dissatisfaction and unnecessary frustration!

Hi cameltoe and welcome to the Forums.

Readings being checked by a third party is something that's been part and parcel of a change of supplier for as long as I've been at E.ON and that's coming up for 10 years. Longer serving colleagues also confirm it was in place before this. I suspect it goes back to privatisation but I'm guessing. The industry regulator will be able to give more information as they're the ones overseeing the whole thing.

There is a fall back though. The Agreed Readings Dispute (ARD) I mentioned above lets the two suppliers re-agree starting/closing readings so customer readings can be used. It's only when the difference falls below set thresholds that this isn't possible. These thresholds are the same for all suppliers and are 250 kWh for electric, 125 units for a 5 dial metric gas meter and 45 units for a 4 dial imperial gas meter.

Usually, when the difference falls below these thresholds, the value is relatively minimal. As above, it's important the starting readings match the former supplier's closing readings. This makes sure the same energy is only charged once. It'll mean paying one supplier a bit more and the other a bit less but the actual amount of energy usage charged will be the same.

Sorry I'm speculating a fair bit here cameltoe but hope it's of interest.

Malc

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

naedanger wrote: »

Questions aimed at E.On

Just to elaborate slightly on the above, I think the key point is how long has this (i.e. using an industry estimate) been common practice when the customer has given an accurate reading?

And what right have companies to do this e.g. contractual or overriding legislation?

I can understand companies may query customer readings but in those circumstances should they not at least attempt to take their own actual reading before using an estimate?

Hi naedanger

Hope my reply to cameltoe above (post 16) gives a bit of an insight into this.

Malc

Rubidium

Thanks Malc but something has changed of late. I have switched many times over the years and only recently have actual supplied reads been changed into stupid estimated reads.

Previously the readings that I have supplied have always been used.

Currently two suppliers are waiting for my money due to this and that is their loss and it is totally unnecessary!

naedanger

E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc wrote: »

Hi naedanger

Hope my reply to cameltoe above (post 16) gives a bit of an insight into this.

Malc

I appreciate my question was generic and not specific to Eon, so thanks for the reply.

Unfortunately I don't think it answers my questions, which concerns the process that should be followed when a customer submits an actual reading (in the correct manner) when switching supplier.

I would assume the customer's actual reading should be used by both suppliers, provided of course that the customer submits it to the correct supplier in a timely manner. Is this correct?

(I can see the need for an industry standard process when two suppliers cannot agree an estimate between them. However if they have an accurate reading I cannot understand why there is any estimation process. And indeed I cannot see how they can contractually or legally justify using an estimate in that circumstance.)

Cardew

At a time when gas/electricity unit(kWh) rates are rising, some people 'fudge' their meter reading at handover by giving a higher reading. Some people on MSE have openly advocated such a practice.


At present it is often possible to get a lower kWh rate, so I suspect the opposite will happen.

naedanger

Cardew wrote: »

At a time when gas/electricity unit(kWh) rates are rising, some people 'fudge' their meter reading at handover by giving a higher reading. Some people on MSE have openly advocated such a practice.


At present it is often possible to get a lower kWh rate, so I suspect the opposite will happen.

And customers can also (fraudulently) do this when a tariff changes, yet suppliers have no right to insist on using their own estimates in that circumstance. (They can insist on taking their own actual reading, which is perfectly reasonable.)

It seems much more likely to me that this industry standard process is to be used only when a customer supplied reading is not available.

No-one has pointed to either a contract term or energy regulation that states this process has to be followed even if a customer provides an actual reading.

Of course if the supplier wishes to obtain their own reading for any reason, including if they suspect the customer reading may be wrong, then they should be entitled to obtain one.

I have no objection to a company insisting on getting their own actual reading, but I would object to them ignoring my actual reading for their estimate.