Do you fear "white flight"..?

mumps

I know many of the villages and it is a lovely area. My point was that Dartmouth has got quite a rough side to it, and I say this as someone who grew up a in very rough inner city area.

Just realised ths is a bit off topic so adding to say Dartmouth is a very white town but you would still need to be careful about where you live. Middle class flight maybe.

mumps

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

I think one of the major factors in a family's choice to buy, or stay, is the school district zoning.

Once the demographics of an area begin to change, the school performance is impacted, for better or worse, and the effect gains its own momentum.

True but if you take Dartmouth alot of the bright kids cross the river to Torbay and go to grammar school. So surrounding areas can make up for a not great school in your area, if you can pass the exam of course.

Davesnave

mumps wrote: »

True but if you take Dartmouth alot of the bright kids cross the river to Torbay and go to grammar school. So surrounding areas can make up for a not great school in your area, if you can pass the exam of course.

I used to work in a predominantly middle class school in a middle class area.

Suddenly, when the SATs results began being published, we started to receive many more children from the other side of the river, which was a much less prosperous area.

The 'customer base' changed markedly within about 5 years. It was as if a new bridge had been opened, although it hadn't, and we'd always been there, available to all-comers.

moneyistooshorttomention

Davesnave wrote: »

I used to work in a predominantly middle class school in a middle class area.

Suddenly, when the SATs results began being published, we started to receive many more children from the other side of the river, which was a much less prosperous area.

The 'customer base' changed markedly within about 5 years. It was as if a new bridge had been opened, although it hadn't, and we'd always been there, available to all-comers.

It would be interesting to know what happened 5 years down the line again from that...ie whether those living there and confidently expecting their children to get in without a problem shrugged their shoulders and thought "Why should we fight for one of our places?" and moved on themselves...

But...yep....I certainly watched the "school effect" in action when it came to selling my last house. The buyer was looking towards what the primary schools were like in the not that distant future. At which point I studied my Rival House that my EA had told me they were also rather interested in. Rival House was cheaper and better than mine - BUT there is no way I would have sent any child to the nearest primary to that:eek:. However, in buying my house the buyer knew they should be able to get at least one of the two best primary schools in the area (as they were near and nearer to my house). I would certainly have been quite happy personally to send a child to the one nearest to that house.

So - I sat back and waited for my buyers parents to start worrying about their grandchildrens' education and telling my buyer which of those two houses they preferred:D

Davesnave

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

It would be interesting to know what happened 5 years down the line again from that...ie whether those living there and confidently expecting their children to get in without a problem shrugged their shoulders and thought "Why should we fight for one of our places?" and moved on themselves...

I don't think there was an issue with places. The city's growing student base meant most schools had plenty of capacity, as more family homes became HMOs etc.

One difference I noted was a gradual loss of upper middle class children; the ones whose parents could easily afford private places, but who believed in allowing their offspring to gain life experience with the masses, at least until age 11. (We'd also picked up a few more of those in the 80s, when their weird, arty-farty school failed to deliver on the 3Rs! :rotfl:)

For whatever reason, more pupils from well-off backgrounds were going straight to private education from the early-90s onwards. I think they, and we, were the poorer for that.

Andrew_Ryan_89

I'm black and to an extent I fear "white flight" but for me it's more of a class thing. Where I group up in Wembley, my mum purchased the property there more than 30 years ago and as you can imagine, the demographics has changed drastically. High prices have risen but our immediate area is full of drunks, people who don't speak English literally hanging out on the streets with nothing to do, spitting tobacco to a point it stains the pavement and walls and every weekend the police are round because of some drunken scene.

Moved in with my fiance to help her out with rent in Harrow. Similar demographic (not as extreme) but the people are just much classier and I have none of the problems mentioned above. We are currently looking for properties near Romford, Chadwell Heath, Harold Wood etc. and I hope that the people moving in are decent people. When we would go to a house viewing, there would be queues of people, sometimes 30+ long, most of them NOT white.

With that said, they all seemed to be young, working-professional types that have been priced out of everywhere else. Also, usually when houses are being sold, I would like to think that you have to be rather decent to afford one in the first place. My main worry moving anywhere is people on benefits and living in council houses, regardless of race.

mumps

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

A phenomenon I see in a nearby town, as a result of public school intake, is the squeezing out of the middle class.

The town is one if the wealthiest places in the country with extraordinarily privileged children. A decision was made to 'bus in' some of the underprivileged (non-white) children from poor towns over the border in the next county in the hope of benefits to all.

The bussed in children have not only brought down the schools results but there is also a cultural gulf in attitudes and behaviour.

The result of this in the school zoning housing area is a gradual relocation of the remaining middle class. These parents and similar potential home owners look elsewhere for better school results.

The upper class, of course, don't have to bother with town public schools for their children so the diminishing results don't worry them at all.

Instead, they swoop in and buy the middle class homes as they become available, knock these modest houses down and build mansions in their place. This gradually removes those streets, house by house, for ever from the grasp of middle class people.

The rich aren't affected, the poor aren't affected but the middle is taking the hit.

Two of my kids are teachers, from what they tell me it is the white British boys who bring the results down, the non white kids do better.

Lleucu

When I was wondering whereabouts to think of in Wales I instantly put Aberystwyth at the top of the list,

Aber is brilliant if you can get a job, good schools, lots of culture and vibrancy, you mentioned the storms, soon repaired, Pro looks pristine, Uni is also on the up. House prices more reasonable a bit inland but on the whole fantastic. Good Council too, Lampeter also very pleasant. Lots of nice villages and small towns, Llandysul is great if you like peace and quiet. Aberaeron expensive but very attractive, Cardigan cheap.

I also like Llanelli, some good villages surrounding it, loads to do and pretty friendly, fantastic beaches.

I love Wales. :j Just wish we had more jobs for young people.

bouicca21

As Mumps said - I used to live in a culturally mixed inner city district and it was the white working class kids who were the problem for local schools. Incredibly low horizons, noticeable even at pre school age when mothers in mother and toddler groups had an overwhelming desire that their kids should be exactly the same as the rest and do nothing to stand out or be deemed "demanding".

moneyistooshorttomention

Lleucu wrote: »

When I was wondering whereabouts to think of in Wales I instantly put Aberystwyth at the top of the list,

Aber is brilliant if you can get a job, good schools, lots of culture and vibrancy, you mentioned the storms, soon repaired, Pro looks pristine, Uni is also on the up. House prices more reasonable a bit inland but on the whole fantastic. Good Council too, Lampeter also very pleasant. Lots of nice villages and small towns, Llandysul is great if you like peace and quiet. Aberaeron expensive but very attractive, Cardigan cheap.

I also like Llanelli, some good villages surrounding it, loads to do and pretty friendly, fantastic be

I love Wales. :j Just wish we had more jobs for young people.

I know about half of that by now - to some extent or another.

....and fully agree with you re the jobs for young people. It doesn't concern me at a very personal level - but it does feel to me like somewhat of a "brain drain" going on. From an English pov = yep...we'll take them on and be glad of them if they are skilled enough. But - I do feel sad from the Welsh pov watching/listening to some of them and sympathising/understanding about any comments they make to me of being part of that brain drain. Its such a shame...

I do admit to having "clicked" to your comment re "good council" for Aberystwyth - as I have been/am right at this moment astonished at watching how some of the Councils operate. I watch them playing "pass the parcel" between themselves sometimes - as none of them want to own up to being responsible for (trans. paying for) some work that needs doing on the one hand and placing luxuries above necessities on the other hand (not that some English councils are free of that particular one sometimes it has to be said.......).