School Holiday Fines

FBaby

There is so much hypocrisy in the system. 2 years ago, a colleague of mine faced having to look at a school for her kids at the last minute as the private school they attended went into administration. They had no warning at all. She contacted the LA for advice, but they were not interested at all and told her that it was up to her to contact local schools to see if they had places for them. She tried but all the schools were over-subscribed so called the LA again to be told 'well we are sorry, but you chose to have your children attend private school, so it's not our fault we can't get a place for your children'.

So amazing how in this case, parent's choice means that they wash their hands or their responsibility towards the children, but when it comes to the choice of taking the kids on hols, that deserves punishing.

In the end, my colleague had no choice but to put her children into another private school, however, this one didn't offer scholarships and they struggled massively financially, putting them all under huge stress. No doubt a much worse situation for the children than if they'd just missed a week of school going on holiday.

phillw

FBaby wrote: »

There is so much hypocrisy in the system.

That is because the system exists purely to justify itself.

If the system was focused on education then it would be run a lot differently.

Anything publicly run will always end up the same way.

jackieblack wrote: »

"Allowed"?
1. Supply and Demand - a basic economic principle
2. Holiday companies say they don't increase prices during peak times, they reduce prices during off peak periods

There is also the desirability factor. A lot of people only want to go to places that rich people can afford, because only rich people can afford to go there. Like if Lambourghinis were the cheapest cars then nobody would want them because they aren't exclusive any more but they are expensive to run, impractical to park anywhere and tend to catch fire. Some people would get lumbered with them but eventually they would disappear.

If a resort is full of rich people during the summer then it drives investment that you can take advantage of during the off peak times for a cheaper amount. You only have to look at our seaside towns to see what happens when only poor people visit.

sheramber

And the other side of the coin. What if the staff take holidays during term time?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-34730214

pollypenny

sheramber wrote: »

And the other side of the coin. What if the staff take holidays during term time?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-34730214

As the news piece, as well as The Guardian article, states, the teacher has been suspended, as any teacher doing that will be suspended from his or her job.

It's likely that he would lose his job and possibly even be suspended by the general Teaching Council and find it hard to get any job.

pollypenny

phillw wrote: »

I think the decision will get overruled as regularly is vaguely defined.

"(3)

The child shall not be taken to have failed to attend regularly at the school by reason of his absence from the school—

(a)

with leave,

(b)

at any time when he was prevented from attending by reason of sickness or any unavoidable cause, or

(c)

on any day exclusively set apart for religious observance by the religious body to which his parent belongs."


However. If the parents make a religious pilgrimage during term time to Italy, spain or wherever then that is ok right?


"The EU is committed to be at the forefront of international efforts to combat religious intolerance and to defend freedom of religion or belief. In doing so, the EU remains neutral and is not supporting any specific religion or belief."


P.S. The cost argument is pretty much irrelevant. If the costs were the same during term time and school holidays then all that would happen is they would sell out quickly and the majority still wouldn't be able to go anyway. They couldn't increase supply as there isn't enough demand throughout the year to cover their costs. You'd still be forced to take your children out of school, but you'd have to pay the same for the privilege as someone who managed to bag time off during the school holidays.



The staff at private school are prepared to help students catch up because their staff are motivated. If you ask the teachers to do more in a state school they will go on strike. You currently get fined because you are an inconvenience to them .

What a load of tosh and slur on millions of state school teachers! :mad:

All teachers I know regularly give up time to help pupils catch up. This is in spite of normal class sizes bring twice those in most private schools.

You talk of strikes as if they happen regularly, rather than rarely.

glodrop

I personally feel that most state schools do not offer a child an effective education by not providing enough affordable cultural educational visits to learn about another country; it's language, it's politics and how it fits in - in the other country's view in the system of things. This is one area where broad-minded parents who think outside the box can help their children......Sadly our government believes most parents are numskulls glued to the telly, taking trips abroad, solely based on depression from the humdrum of daily life!

glodrop

Carole51 wrote: »

I am a retired key stage 1 teacher. A lot of emphasis is put on the effect on children's GCSE grades but actually I think younger children are affected more by missing school. At the age of 5 -7 every day brings new piece of learning and in the days when I was teaching and holidays were allowed it was a nightmare trying to catch children up with stuff they had missed. For example in one week children might be introduced to the concept of practical sharing , dividing objects into two/ three/ four piles etc. , learning what the division sign is, doing simple division problems with apparatus. How difficult for a six year old to then be faced with a sheet of division calculations when s/he comes back off holiday. As a teacher you then have to try and fit in all that one to one teaching while still stretching and supporting the rest of the class. Its the same in other subjects too. Ok it has to be done when children are ill but is a fun holiday more important than key concepts and learning. I'm a mother of 4 and grandmother of 6 and I know that holidays abroad are no more valuable than days out or a week in the holidays in a caravan by the seaside. Its the parents who want the hot weather not the children!

Hmmm I suppose that you had only parents who never kept up with their kids homework and do not homeschool their kids when away from the school environment - and I have to say - many of us do - without even knowing it! Infact there should be an NVQ 5 for most of us - intelligent parents out there - which deems us teachers above all the rest. To all the parents who are concerned day in day out about their children's education. Who think before they speak - who try to make every moment educational. We are not recognised!

Arenasarenas

One very important aspect of this debate that always gets overlooked - every child removed from school during term time is wasting tax payer's hard earned contribution. I'm proud to pay tax so that our country has well educated kids but for this to work it needs bums on seats. Holidays during term time might save parents a few quid (nice for them) but it's costing the rest of us a lot of money - it's just selfish!

Arenasarenas

bylromarha wrote: »

Sits and waits for the following posts

- didn't do me any harm going on holiday in term time
- parents have every right to take their kids out of school
- holiday firms shouldn't force these decisions with such a hike in prices
- what's wrong with taking a holiday in the 13 weeks kids have?
- so it's fine for teachers to strike and have DVD days, but not ok for parents to miss one of these useless days at the end of a term
- add the fine into the cost of your term time holiday as it's bound to be cheaper than a holiday in school holidays
- has anyone thought about people who can only take their holiday from work in term time?
- holidays teach kids far more about the world than a book ever can
- what's educational about 2 weeks by a pool in a hot country?
- term time holidays teach kids it's ok to break the rules
-teachers shouldn't make the rest of the class miss out on their time to catch up a child who has selfishly been away
- holidays are a right, not a priviledge
- holidays are a priviledge, not a right
- what about school staff? They don't get the option.
- my child had 40% attendance rate and got A*s in all his 20 GCSEs

Have I missed any?

You missed one... parents removing children from school are wasting tax payer's money - State schools are not free, hard working tax payers have contributed so kids can be educated.

glodrop

You are very assuming of society aren't you. Put everyone in the same boat. Not everyone has a job in London on the stock exchange. Most of us are hard-working parents who are currently working or have at some time paid well into the tax system prior to or after having children. Many of us despite the fact that we are working or have a business, work this round having our children. We still have to make the school run in the morning and fit work around this. Some of us even have working lives and homeschool their children as an alternative after having given up on this country's poor educational system. However many of us do not have a cushy enough job to pay for the increasing price rise in well-needed holidays. Lets not forget we don't have a 6 weeks break from our jobs - we just have to carry on 24/7 - in our intelligent way - and I truly believe that many parents out there are intelligent enough to take their kids out of school and homeschool them themselves. There have been accounts of single dads with 4 children homeschooling their children to an educational level on a par with certain other country's higher educational standards and getting them through University.