Michelin, Gallaghers etc - lots of bad economic news!

saverbuyer

motorguy wrote: »

Was just thinking about this over the weekend - the average salary in call centres may be low among agents who make up the bulk of the staff, however the vast majority of those people are aged between 18-25.

Surely this has to be seen as a positive, as its getting young people into jobs, which will allow them to progress into better paid jobs in that industry and other industries?

The average salary of a private sector full time employee is something like 19k.


Progressing into better paid jobs isn't reflected in the stats.


Call centers reflect the larger N.I. private sector albeit at salaries below the NI average. There are a large number of workers on crap wages and relatively few on above average.


The vast majority of people (looking at the stats) on crap wages don't move into higher paid roles.


Call centers seem to be filled with low paid transient workers. I've seen various articles showing an average age of anything from 22 - 29 and salaries on average 40% less than the NI average.


It's ok using anecdotes but based on the actual stats, the public sector brings the average salary up considerably here and call centers bring the private sector average down..

saverbuyer

Ticked wrote: »

Nothing surprises me anymore.

The Irish channel adds considerable costs to the price of doing business here. I wouldn't be one bit surprised if moy park closed their NI ops and moved to England.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

Call centers seem to be filled with low paid transient workers.

That would be a misconception.

Average stay is probably something like 18 months. The dolts will be weeded out in a matter of weeks (if they get through recruitment in the first place)and others will leave quite quickly but once you get past that initial period people tend to stay a while.

saverbuyer wrote: »

I've seen various articles showing an average age of anything from 22 - 29 and salaries on average 40% less than the NI average.

Yes, average of 22 fits with my range of 18-25. Dedicated business call centres such as those that Santander and HBOS have will have a higher pay and a higher average age, because people are happy to stay longer due to much better working conditions - less target focused, no scrutiny on average handling times, more holidays, better pay, less time purely on the phones, etc.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

The Irish channel adds considerable costs to the price of doing business here. I wouldn't be one bit surprised if moy park closed their NI ops and moved to England.

They have massive infrastructure here and an established supply chain which they have invested in heavily and continue to invest heavily in.

Their expansion would be in to europe, therefore there will be water to cross anyway.

If the parent company who bought them in 2015 wanted to do that it would have been much more cost effective to buy a company on the mainland, rather than buy an established successful one here and try to uproot it and move it.

Also, as has been said, salaries are lower here - so production costs are lower.

And they're big here and in the south, so moving the whole operation to the mainland just reverses the problem.

saverbuyer

motorguy wrote: »

They have massive infrastructure here and an established supply chain which they have invested in heavily and continue to invest heavily in.

Their expansion would be in to europe, therefore there will be water to cross anyway.

If the parent company who bought them in 2015 wanted to do that it would have been much more cost effective to buy a company on the mainland, rather than buy an established successful one here and try to uproot it and move it.

Also, as has been said, salaries are lower here - so production costs are lower.

And they're big here and in the south, so moving the whole operation to the mainland just reverses the problem.

TBH I'm not sure of the levels of vertical integration in moy park's supply chain here.


For low margin "commodity" items like this, that one extra sea journey can add considerably to costs.


It'll be interesting to see how things go for them.

tara747

motorguy wrote: »

Indeed, however prices have been trending upwards for several years now, and you still havent bought, even though your aim initially was to buy at the bottom of the market.

My aim was (and remains) to buy a house I really like at the right price. There hasn't been a significant movement in prices in the last few years, and I don't see that changing.


Yes. It wont hurt their sales long term, which is what i said. Oh, and whats Octobers best selling car across Europe - VW Golf!

Oh, long term. Fair enough, then.


Yes of course - rent on a 2 bed apartment in say hatfield or slough or woking - aroun £1200 a month. Here - £500-600 a month.

Property prices in the above - semi detached approx £500,000. Here probably £100,000+

And the other things I mentioned? Food, utilities, transport etc are at least as expensive as in the rest of the UK, if not more so.


You mean based on real life examples and actual experience as opposed to "i've found something negative in the news, therefore everything is terrible"?

'Something negative in the news' meaning actual economic data and statistics?

I know people, we all do. Some are doing well, others not so well. They don't make up a huge sample size.


Absolutely not, but neither should it be a "doom and gloom" thread which you seem want to make it.

Well, do feel free to start a thread on how fantastic the NI economy is.

My replies in red.

tara747

saverbuyer wrote: »

The average salary of a private sector full time employee is something like 19k.


Progressing into better paid jobs isn't reflected in the stats.


Call centers reflect the larger N.I. private sector albeit at salaries below the NI average. There are a large number of workers on crap wages and relatively few on above average.


The vast majority of people (looking at the stats) on crap wages don't move into higher paid roles.


Call centers seem to be filled with low paid transient workers. I've seen various articles showing an average age of anything from 22 - 29 and salaries on average 40% less than the NI average.


It's ok using anecdotes but based on the actual stats, the public sector brings the average salary up considerably here and call centers bring the private sector average down..

Perfectly sensible post, thank you saverbuyer.

motorguy

tara747 wrote: »

My aim was (and remains) to buy a house I really like at the right price. There hasn't been a significant movement in prices in the last few years, and I don't see that changing.

Then you're clearly having a blinkered view - prices have been trending upwards for several years now. And even at that if they arent, surely its been statically low for several years - surely an ideal time to buy?

tara747 wrote: »

And the other things I mentioned? Food, utilities, transport etc are at least as expensive as in the rest of the UK, if not more so.

Uh huh, however by far the biggest difference is housing costs. The price of a tin of peas pales into insignificance by comparison.

tara747 wrote: »

'Something negative in the news' meaning actual economic data and statistics?

Ah the Bel Tel economic reporting there - take out something that makes a headline story and run with it.

tara747 wrote: »

Well, do feel free to start a thread on how fantastic the NI economy is.

Or what about just not focusing on the negatives? Controversial i know...

saverbuyer

motorguy wrote: »

Uh huh, however by far the biggest difference is housing costs. The price of a tin of peas pales into insignificance by comparison.

The other side of the equation is salary.


NI average salary is probably 30% or more less than Slough or Hatfield.


Everything with perhaps the exception housing is more expensive here.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

The other side of the equation is salary.


NI average salary is probably 30% or more less than Slough or Hatfield.


Everything with perhaps the exception housing is more expensive here.

How?

We've Tescos, LIDL, ASDA and Sainsburys here, plus loads of very competitive indy supermarkets.

Fuel - maybe a penny or two in it i'm not sure.

Cars - same price - cheaper for some used models.

Home heating oil - probably very similar.

They have council tax, we have rates per house.

Road tax is the same

Insurance "maybe" a bit more expensive, but shouldnt be much if any, comparing area by area.

Electricity - more competitive than it was, not sure on comparables but seems reasonable.

Clothes - all the big names here, and you can order online anyway.

Electricals - same price and you can order online anyway.