Walls and chimney stack removed WITHOUT building and planning permission

karloponti

Thanks a ton for the replies, much appreciated.

We have a meeting with the vendor to see the property today at 1130....fingers X'd.

Agree walk away would be the easy option but there is nothing available for that price range in the market, so I have to be more pragmatic and look for solutions but thanks.

We do plan to tell the seller that we will not exchange until we are satisfied that they have taken retrospective buildings planning permission:T. Thanks

Cleverly their solicitor have said in addition that in the last 4 yrs the vendor is not aware on any alterations.......but what about the time b4 that as she was in the property from 2007 ???

We will ask them as suggested for their Home Buyers survey :Tas I recall the agent pushing us to do a home buyers survey....surely they would have done one if they wanted us to do it.....!!! A home buyers survey would show should show walls removed and alterations to the chimney stack.

Wheelz :T u r absolutely correct when we go to sell we will face the same problems.

I agree if the house was going to fall down because of the alterations then it would probably have done so before now.

No indications were given as to when the alterations were done by the surveyor.

It is possible that the vendor bought the house after they were done, I will try and get them to give me the home buyers survey report.

The property is 1930....semi detached bungalow....:j really wish it was ours but need to think with my head.....:)

Price reduction no chance as there is a Q of buyers and estate agents are pushing to sell. No similar properties in the market and they are pushing the price up by £20,000 if we don't exchange......:mad: Yes u are correct bullying tack ticks.

So we will have to have an action plan as follows:

1. Get vendors to get a retrospective buildings planning permission
2. Get the indemnity and structural engineer survey
3. See if they will give us a copy of the home buyers survey

And say a little prayer that this works.....failing which we need to go to plan C

THANKS A TON ALL OF U :A

stator

Planning permission and building regulations are not that important, it's likely the council couldn't enforce after this length of time anyway.

The important thing is to ensure that the property is safe, so get a qualified structural surveyor to asses the alterations. If there is some question about the work that has been done the surveyor may need to have to do some 'intrusive' inspection, ie take away some of the celing or plaster to see what's underneath. This vendor wouldn't be keen on this so you need to insist.

Doozergirl

karloponti wrote: »

Thanks a ton for the replies, much appreciated.

We have a meeting with the vendor to see the property today at 1130....fingers X'd.

Agree walk away would be the easy option but there is nothing available for that price range in the market, so I have to be more pragmatic and look for solutions but thanks.

We do plan to tell the seller that we will not exchange until we are satisfied that they have taken retrospective buildings planning permission:T. Thanks

Cleverly their solicitor have said in addition that in the last 4 yrs the vendor is not aware on any alterations.......but what about the time b4 that as she was in the property from 2007 ???

We will ask them as suggested for their Home Buyers survey :Tas I recall the agent pushing us to do a home buyers survey....surely they would have done one if they wanted us to do it.....!!! A home buyers survey would show should show walls removed and alterations to the chimney stack.

Wheelz :T u r absolutely correct when we go to sell we will face the same problems.

I agree if the house was going to fall down because of the alterations then it would probably have done so before now.

No indications were given as to when the alterations were done by the surveyor.

It is possible that the vendor bought the house after they were done, I will try and get them to give me the home buyers survey report.

The property is 1930....semi detached bungalow....:j really wish it was ours but need to think with my head.....:)

Price reduction no chance as there is a Q of buyers and estate agents are pushing to sell. No similar properties in the market and they are pushing the price up by £20,000 if we don't exchange......:mad: Yes u are correct bullying tack ticks.

So we will have to have an action plan as follows:

1. Get vendors to get a retrospective buildings planning permission
2. Get the indemnity and structural engineer survey
3. See if they will give us a copy of the home buyers survey

And say a little prayer that this works.....failing which we need to go to plan C

THANKS A TON ALL OF U :A

First of all, it isn't 'buildings planning permission'. You don't need planning permission for internal alterations. It would be 'building control approval' IF it was required. Attempting to do this after a long time is fairly pointless and any indemnity policy you want to buy is useless. It is possible that the wall wasn't supporting and BR weren't required.

So number 2 is whst you want to do. A structural engineer is always the one to assess structural suitability, when you carry out building work. Even when you subsequently ask building control to sign it off, they're only signing off that the work matches the structural engineer's requirements.

However! This is a bungalow, needless to say that any wall removed can be quickly checked for any existing wall to support above by going into the loft. The remived wall obviously isn't going to be supporting a second storey, although it may have had value in holding up roof purlins.

You'd look for bowing in the roof line and a clear line of support for the purlins in the loft.

I have a feeling this isn't going to be a big deal in a bungalow.

What kind of survey did you have? It sounds basic.

franklee

karloponti wrote: »

Cleverly their solicitor have said in addition that in the last 4 yrs the vendor is not aware on any alterations.......but what about the time b4 that as she was in the property from 2007 ???

Have you looked at zoopla and rightmove for the old sale particulars?

On zoopla look for the property history, if it was on zoopla the old sale details should be still available.

On rightmove look up the sold prices, if it was on rightmove the old pictures and floorplan might still be there.

karloponti

[FONT=&quot]Just returned from the property.

Have looked no old photos or floor plans. We have advised the vendors of the problem and they have understood and willing to look into it. Also told us that the estate agents are unnecessary pushing you with the exchange but if there is a problem with the property they have to sort it out, as off now exchange is off for Monday. Lets see now.

Monday the vendors will try and get copies of the plan for the internal walls of the property and see if they were removed or not and send it to our solicitor. This should be there with the original deed of the property.

If the wall was removed then we will ask them, to get a structural engineer to assess structural suitability, for the building work. If however the wall was not removed and the surveyor was wrong, then what do I do? If the RCIS surveyor was incorrect in the assessment that opens a new big can of worms

We had a structural survey done and sadly as I understand the surveyor spent just 30 minutes in the property. Is that sufficient time to do a full structural survey. Not cheap £580.

We have asked questions to the structural surveyor but the surveyor is on annual leave.

At the end of the day it is we who are going to live inside so we need to be satisfied that the structure is safe and sound as u correctly mention.

House buying is supposed to bring joy and happiness, waiting to see the light at the end of this tunnel but you guys have been great. Real help and given us the strength getting our dream house.

Much appreciated and apologies for the incorrect terminology wherever used.:A[/FONT]

Doozergirl

Why would the surveyor making an incorrect assumption be opening a new can of worms?

It would actually close it. Surveyors have to cover themeselves. If they suspect something, it's a good idea to investigate. If it hasn't been done, no harm.

Presumably this comment doesn't affect the valuation anyway? Whatever a structural engineer says will suffice.

At the very worst, someone buys an indemnity policy to make it all go away.

karloponti

Doozergirl..........thanks, I was getting sidelined and should see the more positive side of the report. I agree with you.

Most important is the safety and I thinks we will get a structural engineer to see the place.

Would a structural engineer be able to tell us if there was a wall or any alterations taken place in the property?

Thanks

Doozergirl

karloponti wrote: »

Doozergirl..........thanks, I was getting sidelined and should see the more positive side of the report. I agree with you.

Most important is the safety and I thinks we will get a structural engineer to see the place.

Would a structural engineer be able to tell us if there was a wall or any alterations taken place in the property?

Thanks

With structural walls, yes. There would always be some form of evidence hinting to what was there before.

You can even see these things 100 years later.

karloponti

Is it true with an indemnity policy that you cannot do any further building works.

Thanks

Doozergirl

karloponti wrote: »

Is it true with an indemnity policy that you cannot do any further building works.

Thanks

Look, building control aren't concerned about old knock throughs. If you get it checked by a SE and that comes back clear, building control won't say a word as they won't see anything dangerous if you are carrying out new notifiable work in that area. They're a public service don't have the resource to go looking at marginally questionable knock throughs. They'd have to go looking for court orders and all sorts.

In 16 years of building, we have never had a BCO mention anything other than the work in hand. Never.

If you're still worried, you use a private building control firm.