London Capital and Finance

Supercalafragalistic

AnotherJoe wrote: »

My 2c

Thanks another Joe...and what an interesting 2c it is too :T

ffacoffipawb

rr755507 wrote: »

Literally, money went into personal accounts.

The information was from the joint administrators' Report and Statement:

"There are a number of highly suspicious transactions involving a small group of connected people which have led to large sums of the Bondholders’ money ending up in their personal possession or control. We are pressing these people to return those funds to us for the benefit of the Bondholders and failing this we will pursue those individuals, as appropriate, for recovery of those sums"

&

"Our investigations indicate that some of LCF’s Bondholders’ monies flowed through a variety of transactions, including with regard to deferred consideration, relating to the Waterside and Dominican Republic property companies (see references to WSL, CSL and CSL2 above), which resulted in multi million pounds of those monies going into the personal possession or control of:"

and all the 4 names you suggested. No mention of captain careless.

Sounds very similar to the layering part of money laundering, obfuscating the original source of the funds.

Supercalafragalistic

rr755507 wrote: »

Literally, money went into personal accounts.



and all the 4 names you suggested. No mention of captain careless.

Thanks for the info

Botheredin

ffacoffipawb wrote: »

Sounds very similar to the layering part of money laundering, obfuscating the original source of the funds.

1. Placement - The funds being deposited to LCF via marketing agent / s

2. Layering - Funds laid off to SPV's and "deals" purporting to honour the original investment marketing.

3. Integration - Lay the funds off to existing distressed companies bought for a song or already in being and buy supercars, helis, etc etc etc.

Simples.

Botheredin

1.Who has commited a crime
A. Lcf directors - Almost definitely
B. Surge - Yet to be show but almost certainly a bunch of lacking moral *****
C. Fca - Skating away on a mates rates "independent review"
D. All of the above
E. None of the above

2. Will the investors receive:
A. Up to 20 pc of investment - Most likely but nowhere near 20%
B.More than 20 pc of investment
C. None of the investment

3. If anyone is found culpable, will it be
A. Criminal Case
B. Civil Case
C. Neither - It falls between too many cracks and no official body, civil or criminal, are taking real charge.

4. If anyone is found culpable , will they
A. Have their assetts seized as proceeds of crime
B. Receive jail time
C. All of the above
D, none of the above - Doubtful on jail or assets. It's been left too long... and assets are long gone

5, Was LC and F
A. Permitted to sell their product to retail investors - They got away with it for sure
B. Deliberately ensnaring by adverts andcall centre saying one thing, then paperwork saying something else so it was overlooked - Yes
C. Quite frank about the risk involved - No
D. Deliberately set up to fail - Yes

6. Will Blackmore Bonds
A. Pay out on maturity- Unlikely
B. Not pay out on maturity - Likely
C. Be investigated by fca/sfo - Remains to be seen

dcs34

GDB2222 wrote: »

I received an email from a firm I had never heard from, and I could do with some advice please. It reads as follows:

Ask why they need your money. Not how it will benefit you; not what amazing % of return you are "guaranteed" to get (they can guarantee all the return they like if it's coming out your £25k original investment); if they've got the security, the permission, and an award winning developer, why on earth are they coming to punters like you for relatively small amounts of cash - and why are they giving you 15% back when 8-10% would still be above average return in the sector?

If they're coming to you, uninvited, it's a scam. Don't get tricked into thinking you've got some secret edge over the other suckers; an inside line to better deals and higher rates. You don't. You're the real sucker.

Supercalafragalistic

Botheredin wrote: »

1.Who has commited a crime
A. Lcf directors - Almost definitely
B. Surge - Yet to be show but almost certainly a bunch of lacking moral *****
C. Fca - Skating away on a mates rates "independent review"
D. All of the above
E. None of the above

2. Will the investors receive:
A. Up to 20 pc of investment - Most likely but nowhere near 20%
B.More than 20 pc of investment
C. None of the investment

3. If anyone is found culpable, will it be
A. Criminal Case
B. Civil Case
C. Neither - It falls between too many cracks and no official body, civil or criminal, are taking real charge.

4. If anyone is found culpable , will they
A. Have their assetts seized as proceeds of crime
B. Receive jail time
C. All of the above
D, none of the above - Doubtful on jail or assets. It's been left too long... and assets are long gone

5, Was LC and F
A. Permitted to sell their product to retail investors - They got away with it for sure
B. Deliberately ensnaring by adverts andcall centre saying one thing, then paperwork saying something else so it was overlooked - Yes
C. Quite frank about the risk involved - No
D. Deliberately set up to fail - Yes

6. Will Blackmore Bonds
A. Pay out on maturity- Unlikely
B. Not pay out on maturity - Likely
C. Be investigated by fca/sfo - Remains to be seen

Thanks! It will be interesting to see how this lcf lotto plays out.:j

Reaper

GDB2222 wrote: »

I received an email from a firm I had never heard from... This is a site-specific investment in Birmingham where HSG (High Street Group) are trying to increase the number of apartments.

There's a thread on High Street Group already, though titled under the name of an introducer:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5984347/keystone-property-group-opinions
Well worth looking at the Bond Review article it mentions and in particular the discussion at the end:
https://bondreview.co.uk/2018/01/15/the-high-street-group/

Malthusian

AnotherJoe wrote: »

That's disingenuous.

No it isn't. It's not lying to state facts about the financial system.

It's not the "general" population it's those who insured

The vast majority of people who have anything to nick have home insurance, so yes it is the general population. There are more people with home insurance (80% of households) than there are net contributors in the tax system (c. 40% of the population).

The problem (and this has been brought up many times here) is that if FCA does cover companies like this then people can be even more gung ho about the investments they buy into.

The best case scenario for the investments is that the UK Government finally drags the UK's securities laws out of the 1920s and makes any investment security offering to the public regulated. Or to put it another way, ban unregulated "minibonds" or any other unregulated investment offered to the public.

That would in turn make it possible to compensate LCF investors from the public purse without such a massive moral hazard problem. Nobody would rush out to put their money in unregulated minibonds on the basis that if they get in quick enough they'll get high returns and if they don't they'd be compensated, because unregulated minibonds wouldn't exist any more.

Don't get me wrong, there would still be a moral hazard problem, but plugging the loophole would balance the political equation.

Sledger

jimjames wrote: »

Absolutely. I was asked a few weeks ago by a reporter if I thought it was always planned as fraud and wasn't sure whether it was something that evolved over time.

It's now clear from the administrators report that it was fraud from the start. In 2015 LCF loaned money to one person that was an agreed loan of £15 million. This was at a time when LCF had under £7 million of bonds issued.

I was asked if the names of those arrested were correct. They are the same names as the 4 people listed in the administrators report today

https://damn-lies-and-statistics.blogspot.com/2019/03/london-capital-finance-who-was-arrested.html

Jim this is something I picked up that puzzled me. If there was only 7 million of Bondholders money how did they make a 15 Million Loan I tried looking for another one of their companies operating a similar scam funding it but drew a blank.