Extra Energy

naedanger

Biscuit_Tin wrote: »

Because I do not see anything quoted by Ofgem (by footyguy, or you, the Ofgem website, or indeed within the SLC wording) that does confirm what the OP claims Ofgem clearly states.



Perhaps in light of the answer I provided you to the first question, this is now superfluous?

But, for the sake of clarification, of course the suppliers terms will not take precedence over their licence conditions. I believe the suppliers conditions in this instance are in accordance with the SLC, yet at the same time provide clear and unambiguous clarification to the consumer of those conditions

OK You must have either missed the following or not be understanding what it is saying. This is a straight quote from the standard electricity licence conditions.

24.8 In relation to each Fixed Term Supply Contract, the licensee must ensure that:
(a) a Domestic Customer is entitled to take steps to facilitate changing to any other Electricity Supplier (but not complete the process of changing supplier) at any time without having to pay a Termination Fee;
(b) unless the Domestic Customer has already entered into a new Fixed Term Supply Contract with the licensee or paragraph 22C.5 of standard condition 22C applies, a Domestic Customer is entitled to switch to any other Electricity Supplier at any time during or after the Switching Window without having to pay a Termination Fee;

What do you think the above is saying?

Biscuit_Tin

naedanger wrote: »

OK You must have either missed the following or not be understanding what it is saying. This is a straight quote from the standard electricity licence conditions.

24.8 In relation to each Fixed Term Supply Contract, the licensee must ensure that:
(a) a Domestic Customer is entitled to take steps to facilitate changing to any other Electricity Supplier (but not complete the process of changing supplier) at any time without having to pay a Termination Fee;
(b) unless the Domestic Customer has already entered into a new Fixed Term Supply Contract with the licensee or paragraph 22C.5 of standard condition 22C applies, a Domestic Customer is entitled to switch to any other Electricity Supplier at any time during or after the Switching Window without having to pay a Termination Fee;

What do you think the above is saying?

I know you are not going to agree with me on this, and I suspect no amount of persuasion is going to change that, but in answer to your questions, yes I did read that - you posted it in post#8 made over an hour before I first posted in this thread, and that, in my opinion, it means exactly what Ofgem intended it to mean, having first consulted the industry on those proposed changes.
i.e. as footyguy has already quoted

You will receive a notice 42-49 days before the end date of your fixed term tariff to inform you that your tariff is coming to an end. Should you choose to switch after this point, suppliers can’t charge you a termination fee.

Perhaps you need to look back at the history of how this change came about to obtain a better understanding.
Originally early exit fees could be applied up until the end date specified in the contract.

As consumers started to push the boundaries, this led to a number of uncertainties as to when a consumer could initiate a switch. (look back at some of the many older threads on this board that asked that exact question to see how much confusion it did cause)

The only 100% safe way was to wait until the contract had ended, because the consumer cannot usually set the actual switch date, and so at which point the consumer could be left languishing for 6 weeks or more on the suppliers expensive standard tariff (or worse! ... but that was also addressed in the revisions) before a switch to a different supplier actually went live.

Consumers pushed the boundaries as they tried to second guess how long a switch would take, thereby minimising the time from end of contract until the switch actually occurred. But do it too soon, and the consumer was lumped with an early exit fee as the switch actually occurred before contract end date.

So, in an attempt to avoid ongoing confusion to the consumer, Ofgem decided (in conjunction with the whole industry) that suppliers should, between 49 and 42 days before the end date, contact consumers giving notice that the contract was coming to an end, and the options available to the consumer to consider.

This would give consumers plenty of time to consider their options safe in the knowledge that what they did from that point would not incur them in early exit fees.

If you interpret the rules as you appear to wish to do so, then the revisions do nothing to remove the then existing confusion - all it would essentially do is bring the whole messy situation forward by 49 days.

[Also, to follow your earlier example, if the rules were meant to mean the interpretation you appear to wish to attempt to put on them, why wouldn't they simply say something like:
"Suppliers will be banned from charging a termination fee at any time within the last 49 days of the contract end date, and any time thereafter (in regards to that fixed term contact)"]

naedanger

Biscuit_Tin wrote: »

I know you are not going to agree with me on this, and I suspect no amount of persuasion is going to change that, but in answer to your questions, yes I did read that - you posted it in post#8 made over an hour before I first posted in this thread, and that, in my opinion, it means exactly what Ofgem intended it to mean, having first consulted the industry on those proposed changes.
i.e. as footyguy has already quoted

Perhaps you need to look back at the history of how this change came about to obtain a better understanding.
Originally early exit fees could be applied up until the end date specified in the contract.

As consumers started to push the boundaries, this led to a number of uncertainties as to when a consumer could initiate a switch. (look back at some of the many older threads on this board that asked that exact question to see how much confusion it did cause)

The only 100% safe way was to wait until the contract had ended, because the consumer cannot usually set the actual switch date, and so at which point the consumer could be left languishing for 6 weeks or more on the suppliers expensive standard tariff (or worse! ... but that was also addressed in the revisions) before a switch to a different supplier actually went live.

Consumers pushed the boundaries as they tried to second guess how long a switch would take, thereby minimising the time from end of contract until the switch actually occurred. But do it too soon, and the consumer was lumped with an early exit fee as the switch actually occurred before contract end date.

So, in an attempt to avoid ongoing confusion to the consumer, Ofgem decided (in conjunction with the whole industry) that suppliers should, between 49 and 42 days before the end date, contact consumers giving notice that the contract was coming to an end, and the options available to the consumer to consider.

This would give consumers plenty of time to consider their options safe in the knowledge that what they did from that point would not incur them in early exit fees.

If you interpret the rules as you appear to wish to do so, then the revisions do nothing to remove the then existing confusion - all it would essentially do is bring the whole messy situation forward by 49 days.

[Also, to follow your earlier example, if the rules were meant to mean the interpretation you appear to wish to attempt to put on them, why wouldn't they simply say something like:
"Suppliers will be banned from charging a termination fee at any time within the last 49 days of the contract end date, and any time thereafter (in regards to that fixed term contact)"]

I have the answer to my question. You don't understand the wording.

I will try and explain it but it seems so clear that it is hard to simplify it.

Paragraph 24.8 (a) says a customer can take any steps towards changing supplier, short of completing the transfer, at any time without having to pay a termination fee.

Paragraph 24.8 (b) says a supplier can charge a termination fee if the transfer takes place before the start of the transfer window (or some other circumstances not relevant to the OP).


To further spell it out:

Paragraph 24.8 (a) prohibits the OP's supplier from levying a termination fee based on the date he initiated the transfer.

Paragraph 24.8(b) prohibits the OP's supplier from levying a termination charge because the transfer completed after the start of the transfer window.

The OP was correct. His supplier agrees.