Pre-reg cars

AdrianC

I'd also be looking closely at whether there's a particular reason THAT exact car is a pre-reg at a discount.

Maybe it's simply a target question.
Maybe it was a cancelled order.
Maybe it was a run-out model before a spec change.
Maybe it was forgotten about in a pre-delivery field for a few months or longer.
Maybe it was damaged during delivery, and has been repaired.

Buzby

motorguy wrote: »

Compared to what? List price? What cars were they?

Compared to list - clearly anyone with half a brain will manage to get something off a list price, being able to breath is a useful qualification. The cars purchased are irrelevant to the point being made, but since you asked, both were Renault's the first being an Espace IV diesel and the second a Fluence electric.

motorguy wrote: »

Yes they did. Try buying one you've "saved" £22K on and then taking it back the following week and see if the dealer gives you the invoice price.

I did just that with the third, as a trade in of a pre-reg. A Twizy - purchased with 12 miles on the clock at £3.5k which was 50% off list. I took it back not a week, but a year later (to a different dealer) and got £3.6k on it - the first time I ever made money on a car.

As to the same dealer giving you the invoice price a week later... what would that prove, other than they were as daft as the purchaser? It's what anyone gives you for it that counts.

Buzby

motorguy wrote: »

+1

Also, you wont be able to avail of new car incentives such as complementary upgrades, finance contributions, lower rate finance, etc, etc.

They can definintely be cheaper than buying new, but its not a "given" that they will be.

Complementary upgrades? Like stuff you'd never dream of paying for and you get free because they cannot shift them otherwise? Losing out on paying car tax and vat give instant savings regardless of any other consideration.

AdrianC

"car tax"? As in the 10% tax on new car purchases? That died in the 1980s... VAT is the only tax payable on a new car - and you're paying it on a pre-reg, too.

motorguy

Buzby wrote: »

Compared to list - clearly anyone with half a brain will manage to get something off a list price, being able to breath is a useful qualification. The cars purchased are irrelevant to the point being made, but since you asked, both were Renault's the first being an Espace IV diesel and the second a Fluence electric.

And clearly anyone with half a brain would see that saying you got £22,000 off means diddly as noone pays list price anyway. You certainly didnt save those amounts compared to purchasers of identical brand new cars.

And thats part of the problem with pre-reg cars - people instinctively "think" they've got huge sums off, but the vast bulk of that is avail as discount to new car buyers anyway.

You can buy a pre-reg 15 plate Astra 1.4 Excite for £9495 on autotrader, which is supposedly a £7,500 saving, yet last week Pentagon had an offer on brand new ones priced at £9995 with a free £500 fuel card.

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/brand-new-astra-1-4-petrol-excite-with-500-fuel-card-ends-21st-sept-15-9995-pentagon-2283830?p=26041930

No doubt the buyers of the pre-reg cars are telling themselves and their friends they saved £7,500 but the reality is they saved about £500 and now have a car thats on the previous plate and is probably worth £500 less come resale time anyway.

Buzby wrote: »

I did just that with the third, as a trade in of a pre-reg. A Twizy - purchased with 12 miles on the clock at £3.5k which was 50% off list. I took it back not a week, but a year later (to a different dealer) and got £3.6k on it - the first time I ever made money on a car.

Obscure stuff like that are the exception, not the rule. Try doing that with a Ford Focus. And likewise did you "really" get £3,600 for it, or was that the paperwork price that a dealer uses smoke and mirrors to produce?

Buzby wrote: »

As to the same dealer giving you the invoice price a week later... what would that prove, other than they were as daft as the purchaser? It's what anyone gives you for it that counts.

It was an example of how in reality you still take a big hit on a pre-reg - you almost invariably dont avoid depreciation unless its very obscure or very rare.

motorguy

Buzby wrote: »

Complementary upgrades? Like stuff you'd never dream of paying for and you get free because they cannot shift them otherwise? Losing out on paying car tax and vat give instant savings regardless of any other consideration.

No - complementary upgrades as in free upgrade from SE to M Sport, which translates to a considerable saving.

I'll give you an example. My wife went to buy a Z4 back in 2012, new. The dealer shower her a late 2011 car in white with red leather (she wanted black with black leather but anyways) pre-reg, minimal miles for "£7000 off list price" at £29,000.

We pushed on the new car deals and priced a brand new car with the latest higher power engine, M Sport, which she wanted, and black with black leather. List price £35,995.

Firstly there was a "complimentary upgrade" of SE to M Sport which translated to a £2,500 saving.

THEN we got a further 9% saving off the dealer through discount, so £3,300 or thereabouts, THEN there was a finance contribution of £1,500 by BMW, so all in all the discounted price was around £29,500.

And that was for a brand new car, 2012, factory order with the spec she wanted.

motorguy

Buzby wrote: »

Losing out on paying car tax and vat give instant savings regardless of any other consideration.

Oh dear, now this is a bit embarassing.

You dont pay new car tax anymore and the VAT rate on a new car has nothing to do with the price of a used car. You dont "save" the VAT on a pre-reg car.

Oh, cringing for you.

Still, i guess it explains why you think you got a good deal....

Buzby

Actually, I did 'save' £22k some six months later from the price actually paid by another purchaser... we still see each other in the same city, identical model, spec and colour. They were a business so reclaimed the VAT proportion allowable, but who was to know the manufacture would discontinue the marque after 2 years? I did as my research threw this up, but as it came with a 5 year warranty I didn't care. There are only around 64 of them on the roads in the UK, but whether 'obscure' or not, pre reg and nearly new still offer many a first rate car for a price they may never have considered.

Sure, if you finance or lease your options diminish as you'll pay the price most other users think is 'normal' which is a pity. As for the 'big hit' by returning a pre-reg, I was lucky agreed, but it is not impossible if you think outside the box. Having just had a test drive in a fully specced Infiniti Q70 Hybrid with a list price of £54k, I got this down to £48.5k with very little haggling. Imagine my surprise at tracking down a seller disposing of one with 825m on the clock and 10 months old... at £24k with original invoice and servicing history. Yes, this isn't your run of the mill Ford XXX but if you wanted luxury at a superb price, it's a no brainer.

Buzby

motorguy wrote: »

Oh dear, now this is a bit embarassing.

You dont pay new car tax anymore and the VAT rate on a new car has nothing to do with the price of a used car. You dont "save" the VAT on a pre-reg car.

Oh, cringing for you.

Still, i guess it explains why you think you got a good deal....

Cringe away - especially if you think the only tax on a car is VAT! The Car Tax of old was indeed very unfair, as it was a tax on a tax, BUT the OTR price is invariably inclusive - it has to be by law. So sorry your point-scoring game didn't work. But do keep me amused with your justification that only buying new is the way to go.

bigjl

Discounts are out there on loads of cars.

A colleague just got £12k discount on a new shape S Class.