HELP telediscount problems with bt

semtal

it seems telediscount no longer works at 1p per min to the us from a bt landline. quite a shock to find all my 0844 telediscount calls added up to 500 quid or more from july. been ill or would have noticed it sooner. bt say 0844 is still 1p pm. would appreciate some alternatives that work and an update as to what happened. telediscount was fine for 10 years. gutted and in shock now.

Ian011

On 1 July 2015, Ofcom ended the regulation that prevented BT making margin when originating calls to 084, 087, 09 and 118 numbers. Prior to that date, almost all of the money you paid for the call was passed on and paid to the benefit of the telecoms provider that runs the non-geographic number.

Since 1 July 2015 BT has been allowed to make margin on originating calls to these numbers, bringing BT into line with what all other providers have always been able to do. At the same time, the call price from all providers has been split into two parts, each separately declared.

Your landline or mobile provider sets and declares their Access Charge. This varies from 2p to 12p per minute depending on which landline provider you use. BT's is 9.58p per minute. Mobile providers have set their rates between 5p and 45p per minute.

The service provider using the 084, 087, 09 or 118 number sets the Service Charge. In your case, the international dial-through provider has set their rate at 1p per minute.

There are a number of threads on this topic in this forum.



See also
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5292529
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5219071

Ypaymore

If your with BT you can still use 18185 indirectly for cheaper intl calls.

https://www.18185.co.uk

semtal

@Ian011, Ypaymore and the person who PM'd me, thank you for taking the time to explain what happened, and to offer alternatives. I have much to learn, but could really do with a quick solution that offers what I had prior to July 2015 (unless that is a thing is the past).

From what I've read, my options using a BT landline to call the USA are as follows:

1) Pay the 'bump' in price of just under 10p (up to 20p depending on the service provider) per minute (BT 9.58p per minute Access Charge and 1p per minute service charge -if Telediscount is being truthful about the cost, which looking at the cost per call from July, I'm doubting-).

2) Use a site like 18185, although I have no idea if they are any better in terms of reputation or price.

3) Use my 'Inclusive calls'/minutes to 0845 and 0870 numbers (as BT says 'from 7pm to 7am on weekdays and all weekend, for up to an hour') with a site like amigodial. That's not really an option though, as I talk to family and friends for several hours at a time. Can you hang up after an hour and just redial/'reset the clock' or is 'up to an hour' your lot?

4) Using some kind of Skype service, via the Internet (not for me).

I know it's old news, but has everyone who used these services to call friends and family just accepted the price rise, or are there other ways to still get cheaper calls via this method?

Are the '0.5p' '1p' prices listed from the companies on the MSE Call Checker still valid? A lot are listed when I set it for a BT landline from the UK calling the USA, but most use the 084 numbers. I'm wary of getting caught out again.

The_Groat_Counter

semtal wrote: »

From what I've read, my options using a BT landline to call the USA are as follows:
...
2) Use a site like 18185, although I have no idea if they are any better in terms of reputation or price.

I'd recommend you give them a go. In terms of price they are very competitive. They've been around for ages - don't be put off by the old-fashioned looking website.

Other options include using pre-paid calling cards, which involve either dialling via standard UK landline number then calling your international number, or dialling a freephone (0800 or 0808) number then your international number.

The first way works well if you can call UK landline numbers as part of your calling plan, the second way via a freephone number will be a bit more expensive.

semtal wrote: »

Are the '0.5p' '1p' prices listed from the companies on the MSE Call Checker still valid? A lot are listed when I set it for a BT landline from the UK calling the USA, but most use the 084 numbers. I'm wary of getting caught out again.

They are still valid... BUT they are only one part of the total price you will pay, the "service charge". Your provider (in your case BT) will then add on their own "access charge".

This is BT's explanation of the change:
http://bt.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/51727/

This is OfCom's explanation on a special website they set up to communicate the changes:
http://www.ukcalling.info/whats-happening

Ian011

The 0.5p per minute and similar prices are definitely incorrect. The Service Charge is always a whole number of pence, including VAT.

The other prices are questionable. The only certainty is that the Service Charge for 084 numbers cannot be more than 7p per minute and for 087 numbers cannot be more than 13p per minute.

A list of the 80 valid price points can be found here:
http://www.icc-uk.com/NGCS-Price-Points.php

The_Groat_Counter

Ian011 wrote: »

The 0.5p per minute and similar prices are definitely incorrect. The Service Charge is always a whole number of pence, including VAT.
...

Is this a new rule post 1st July? Because beforehand there were definitely numbers which had a 0.5p per minute charge.

dialdfordave

semtal wrote: »

3) Use my 'Inclusive calls'/minutes to 0845 and 0870 numbers (as BT says 'from 7pm to 7am on weekdays and all weekend, for up to an hour') with a site like amigodial. That's not really an option though, as I talk to family and friends for several hours at a time. Can you hang up after an hour and just redial/'reset the clock' or is 'up to an hour' your lot?

You can hang up after an hour and redial. You should be aware though that BT has a "fair use policy" in effect limiting you to a maximum of 1000 minutes or 150 calls per month to 0845/0870 numbers. This is mentioned on the amigodial web site.

If you make more than 1000 minutes of calls per month then you could consider a combination of such a service along with 18185 for example.

dialdfordave

The_Groat_Counter wrote: »

Is this a new rule post 1st July? Because beforehand there were definitely numbers which had a 0.5p per minute charge.

There were indeed numbers which cost 0.5p (from a BT line) before 1st of July.

Ian011

The_Groat_Counter wrote: »

Is this a new rule post 1st July? Because beforehand there were definitely numbers which had a 0.5p per minute charge.

Yes it is a new rule. See Ofcom's General Condition 17.

The Service Charge must be a whole number of pence, including VAT. The Service Charge stays the same irrespective of which landline or mobile network you call the number from. There are 80 Service Charge price points that have been approved. The list is here:
http://www.icc-uk.com/NGCS-Price-Points.php
There is room in the system for an additional 20 price points if these are found to be needed.

Each one of the almost 18 000 blocks of 084, 087 and 09 numbers and each individual 118 number has an assigned Service Charge from this list.

There are four types of Service Charge. These drop-down lists may be easier to access:
http://giffgaff.screet.co.uk/call?n=0f0t0t
The old system also had the same four types of charge, but with the added complication that some varied in price from day to night to weekend. Price variation by time of day is no longer allowed.

Prior to 1 July 2015, for calls to 084, 087, 09 and 118 numbers, there were in excess of 300 different price points (g6, i4, p27, dq58, etc) and each one differed in price on each landline and mobile network due to the fact that each network added a different level of markup on top of whatever they had to pass on. This markup also differed depending on which number was being called. Only BT's retail call rates had any sort of guarantee as they were the only ones prevented by regulation from making margin on call origination to these numbers; that regulation has since ended.

Under the new system, each landline and mobile provider declares a single rate of Access Charge in place of publishing a list of 300 price points. The Access Charge varies by landline or mobile provider used to make the call. The Service Charge varies by number called and must be declared by the called party everywhere their number is advertised. The caller adds together the Access and Service Charge to find the total call cost.

In this way, the cost of calling any 084, 087, 09 or 118 number from any landline or mobile network will be known in advance of making the call and without having to plough through hundreds of pages of price tables on each network.

The_Groat_Counter

Thanks for the clarification and further explanation Ian.

The old days of being easily able to get half-penny a minute calls* to lots of international destinations from a BT line without having to fuss around with opening accounts or buying calling cards are well and truly over!

(* Mustn't forget there was always a per-call connection charge as well though - but it was still amazing value!)