Why do some cyclists use the entire lane, use fog horns, and flashing lights?????????

trinidadone

brat wrote: »

You brought the topic up. You thought that only emergency vehicles could use flashing lights, which wasn't correct on many levels. The HC and the RVL regs make that quite clear.


When you are in your car, what do you do to keep to the left? What is your position within your lane? Is it to the left of the lane, or the centre of the lane, or the right of the lane? I'd suggest that most people drive in the centre, perhaps slightly towards the right of their lane. Are they wrong? Or do you think that only cyclists should be consigned to the left hand side of their lane as per your interpretation of Rule 160?

Seems like flashing lights on peddal power cant be used on non on street lighting roads, thats interesting!!!!

I dont remember this poster ever stating they were in a car????? you know you cant compare a pedal bike with a car. the two forms of transport are so extremely different, they have little in common!!! I mean moter vehicles often do not have positioning of a lane, they take up an actual lane, dont they??? but then not all roads have clear road markings of "lanes" but simply have a road. You said, most people drive "in the centre" or slightly "towards the right of their lane" they must have really big road lanes where you are???? I thought most drivers are exted to drive on the left, and drive on the right to overtake????

Prothet_of_Doom

trinidadone wrote: »

what do you mean "when i blast past" the push bike?

What do you think I mean ? :rotfl:

When motorists get frustrated by the cyclists slowing them down, they tend to drive past too close whilst attempting to play chicken with cars coming the other way. Obviously You and I would never drive like that, or would we ? :j

wealdroam

trinidadone wrote: »

Seems like flashing lights on peddal power cant be used on non on street lighting roads, thats interesting!!!!

Is that so?

Where did you read that?

prowla

brat wrote: »

You brought the topic up. You thought that only emergency vehicles could use flashing lights, which wasn't correct on many levels. The HC and the RVL regs make that quite clear.

Sure, I clarified that they are legal but not recommended.

I could also have highlighted the rule about dazzling other road users, such as by shining a bright light at eye level.

brat wrote: »

When you are in your car, what do you do to keep to the left? What is your position within your lane? Is it to the left of the lane, or the centre of the lane, or the right of the lane? I'd suggest that most people drive in the centre, perhaps slightly towards the right of their lane. Are they wrong? Or do you think that only cyclists should be consigned to the left hand side of their lane as per your interpretation of Rule 160?

Au contraire, I would suggest that the rule states that they should keep to the left of their lane, especially on a single carriageway, where I would say it is most common.

And I was pointing out what the Highway Code states; the so-called "primary position" is not mentioned in the Highway Code and specifically contradicts the rule there. The Highway Code defines the rules of the road; if cyclists are being advised (by whom?) to use the road in contradiction to the Highway Code, then it is little wonder that conflicts and misunderstandings arise.

trinidadone

wealdroam wrote: »

Is that so?

Where did you read that?

read above, its all there

prowla

So, we have the law(s) of the road, we have the Highway Code which is the de-facto manual for all road users and includes "musts" and "shoulds" (and you can fail your driving test on the "shoulds"), and we have a different set of recommendations which are being communicated to cyclists under a different scheme but are not law and are not being communicated to other road users.

In effect we have cyclists using the road to a different set of (unofficial) rules to those which motorists are governed by.

If that's not a recipe for confusion, then I don't know what is!

I suppose it does help explain how some of the accidents happen.

brat

prowla wrote: »

Sure, I clarified that they are legal but not recommended.

They are legal, and they are the best type of light for being noticed, and for being identified as a cyclist. That was why they were used before they were legal, and why they were legalised. They are not recomended for use on their own when there is no other streetlighting, which makes good sense.

prowla wrote: »

I could also have highlighted the rule about dazzling other road users, such as by shining a bright light at eye level.

You just did. Why?

prowla wrote: »

Au contraire, I would suggest that the rule states that they [motorists and cyclists] should keep to the left of their lane, especially on a single carriageway, where I would say it is most common.

Perhaps it's time to retake a driving test. If you did you would discover the correct lane position for road users. http://www.driving-test-success.com/road-positioning.htm

Driving_Test_Success wrote:

In normal circumstances you should position your car in the centre of your half of the road

If a lane is exceptionally wide, one should stay towards the left of that lane to allow other road users to use the space if necessary, but in normal lane width, the centre is where you should be.

prowla wrote: »

And I was pointing out what the Highway Code states; the so-called "primary position" is not mentioned in the Highway Code and specifically contradicts the rule there. The Highway Code defines the rules of the road; if cyclists are being advised (by whom?) to use the road in contradiction to the Highway Code, then it is little wonder that conflicts and misunderstandings arise.

I trust you now understand that it doesn't contradict any of the Highway Code. The requirement to keep left is to keep to the left side of the road, the left lane if there is one, unless there is a reason not to. Advanced drivers will often move to the offside of a road to get the best view - it allows them the best opportunity to see and be seen.

Bikeability is the government approved cycle training organisation, and they (and all other cycle training groups) recommend using the primary road position (centre lane) unless there is good reason (there usually is) to adopt the secondary position.
Cyclists do not want to inconvenience motorists. They consider their safety as the most important aspect of their ride, so many will adopt a primary position for that reason alone. Motorists will usually be unaffected by this, unless they wanted to overtake when it is unsafe to do so.

Have a good read of the Bikeability and Cyclecraft advice on Primary and Secondary road positioning for cyclists. It makes really good sense, and will help you understand why we do what we do.

wealdroam

trinidadone wrote: »

wealdroam wrote: »

trinidadone wrote: »

Seems like flashing lights on peddal power cant be used on non on street lighting roads, thats interesting!!!!

Is that so?

Where did you read that?

read above, its all there

I assume you mean Prowla's quote from the Highway Code... "Flashing lights are permitted but it is recommended that cyclists who are riding in areas without street lighting use a steady front lamp.".

I'm just puzzled about how you can leap from a recommendation about a front cycle light, to a command that (all) flashing lights on bikes are banned.

trinidadone

brat wrote: »

They are legal, and they are the best type of light for being noticed, and for being identified as a cyclist. That was why they were used before they were legal, and why they were legalised. They are not recomended for use on their own when there is no other streetlighting, which makes good sense.


You just did. Why?



Perhaps it's time to retake a driving test. If you did you would discover the correct lane position for road users. http://www.driving-test-success.com/road-positioning.htm



If a lane is exceptionally wide, one should stay towards the left of that lane to allow other road users to use the space if necessary, but in normal lane width, the centre is where you should be.


I trust you now understand that it doesn't contradict any of the Highway Code. The requirement to keep left is to keep to the left side of the road, the left lane if there is one, unless there is a reason not to. Advanced drivers will often move to the offside of a road to get the best view - it allows them the best opportunity to see and be seen.

Bikeability is the government approved cycle training organisation, and they (and all other cycle training groups) recommend using the primary road position (centre lane) unless there is good reason (there usually is) to adopt the secondary position.
Cyclists do not want to inconvenience motorists. They consider their safety as the most important aspect of their ride, so many will adopt a primary position for that reason alone. Motorists will usually be unaffected by this, unless they wanted to overtake when it is unsafe to do so.

Have a good read of the Bikeability and Cyclecraft advice on Primary and Secondary road positioning for cyclists. It makes really good sense, and will help you understand why we do what we do.

I am seeing confusion here. drivers are told to drive left, and stay left, and to over tack on the right, yet cyclecraft give advice for cycles to cycle in the middle of the lane, which is described as the primary position. is this not where the tension is between cycles and moterists???

wealdroam

trinidadone wrote: »

I am seeing confusion here. drivers are told to drive left, and stay left, and to over tack on the right, yet cyclecraft give advice for cycles to cycle in the middle of the lane, which is described as the primary position. is this not where the tension is between cycles and moterists???

Your confusion seems to be with your understanding of 'lane' and 'highway'. Those words are not interchangeable.