Residents association query

Mummyisbeauty

How is he the head of the residents association if he lives in london but flat is in Scotland?

moneyistooshorttomention

Mummyisbeauty wrote: »

How is he the head of the residents association if he lives in london but flat is in Scotland?

Just what I was wondering...its always been my understanding that residents associations are made up of residents.

Though, admitted that OP isn't the resident personally - but I would have thought someone running things would absolutely have to be one!

This just sounds like a very weird set-up all round. That closing the vote a week early too sounds a little odd.

If theres a closing date - then theres a closing date - and I would have thought it would have to be adhered to. All round it sounds like he's making things up as he goes along and not taking any account whatsoever of the Proper Way To Do Things.

Not an easy situation - as I get the point G_M is making that there has to be an element of checking out everyone gets insurance on their property if its a flat. To be honest - that particular thought about flats hadn't ever crossed my mind....but then I've only come across one person (to my knowledge) daffy enough not to bother insuring their home before now. I understand there are a noticeable number of people who don't bother to insure their home once there is no mortgage company insisting it should be:eek:.

Beavishep

G_M wrote: »

Well it seems you need to find out the answers to all these questions.

Only then can you get reliable advice as to "do we have to pay this money amd what can he do if we refuse?"

As this is Scotland, you need advice from someone familiar with Scottish property law. As the Scots like to do stuff differently it is not the same as it would be in Eng/Wales. However, you'll still need answers to the questions posed.

But you might be best advised not to rock the boat. If he stops 'managing' the property, you might end up with no management.

Imagine for example if no one checks that each flat owner has taken out insurance. The building burns down. The fact that your insurer will pay to rebuild your flat will be of no use if the flat below yours is uninsured!

(so another thing to consider is organising a single proper block building policy, with each flat conribuing. Whether the RA is the correct organisation to do this depends again on the legal constitution of the RA.

As i stated he wont return calls so its proving difficult to get any answers at all!!

I understand your point about someone checking the insurances etc, but as for not rocking the boat just in case he stops managing these things, does that mean that we just have to accept everything he asks and keep handing over money to keep him happy? Seeing as he is not carpeting the whole shared building i am 100% convinced that next year his hand will be out for money to re-carpet the rest of the building.

This is our first property that we have bought to rent out so obviously we still have a lot to learn about these things, is it normal practice for this kind of thing to happen?

To answer another question, he is in london as thats where he lives, he owns the 2 flats at the top floor of the building, hence why he has started the re-carpeting on the top floor, so that we can all view the carpet and make comment on it.
I am just back from visiting the building and the carpets have been started and also the painter has painted most of the staircase already, strange as he only closed the vote on friday and the letter only arrived yesterday, makes me think that je has just pleased himself anyway.
Also a note on it being a residents association, most of the flats in the building are rented out so very few owners actually live in their flats, i have no idea why it is called a residents association but he introduced himself as the head of the residents association!

moneyistooshorttomention

Beavishep wrote: »

To answer another question, he is in london as thats where he lives, he owns the 2 flats at the top floor of the building, hence why he has started the re-carpeting on the top floor, so that we can all view the carpet and make comment on it.
I am just back from visiting the building and the carpets have been started and also the painter has painted most of the staircase already, strange as he only closed the vote on friday and the letter only arrived yesterday, makes me think that je has just pleased himself anyway.
Also a note on it being a residents association, most of the flats in the building are rented out so very few owners actually live in their flats, i have no idea why it is called a residents association but he introduced himself as the head of the residents association!

"Started the re-carpeting on the top floor, so that we can all view the carpet and make comment on it":cool:, = yeh right and I'm a monkeys uncle (or aunt in my case).

He only "closed the vote" 2 days ago and work has commenced already = another "yeah right".

I don't think so somehow....

At a guess - its called "residents association" because it once used to be (ie all residents) and he is avoiding setting things up on a different basis for a reason (one which will suit himself doubtless). Perhaps he thinks that, if things were on a different basis, then he might have to do things more "formally" (ie in the correct way). Hence he prefers it to remain a "residents association"....hmmm..

Beavishep

I have just managed to get him on the phone, surprisingly when i questioned his methods he spat the dummy and said that i could take the job on if i wasnt happy, he also said that if we dont pay then he will take us to the small claims court and make us pay, when i asked him why he wasnt holding an agm every year to discuss upcoming maintenance his reply was that most of the flat owners dont live anywhere near the flats, with 3 living in england, another in inverness and the rest spread over scotland, he then added oh well put me in jail for not having an agm!
He did say that when he bought his first flat it was from the woman who was running the association and he just adopted the position as nobody else wanted it.

moneyistooshorttomention

I'd have called his bluff at that point personally - and said "Yeh...alright then I will take on the position". That would have flummoxed him - as I don't suppose he meant it for one minute. I would have concluded by telling him that, since I was taking on the position, then I would need him to send me the Associations paperwork through quickly - so that I could get on top of it and then innocently enquiring as to when I might expect to receive it in the post.

I'm just thinking of a (totally different) thing I belong to and it duly has an AGM every year. I always get sent the stuff through for the meeting - which I don't attend (because its in London). However, I do have the right to know whats what and to vote. I'm not bothered - so I don't bother - but my chance is there if I want it. So I could duly "have my say" re motions/officers/etc if I were so minded.

I would have thought that this "Residents Association" would have to work on the same basis?

DandelionPatrol

Beavishep wrote: »

I have just managed to get him on the phone, surprisingly when i questioned his methods he spat the dummy and said that i could take the job on if i wasnt happy, he also said that if we dont pay then he will take us to the small claims court and make us pay, when i asked him why he wasnt holding an agm every year to discuss upcoming maintenance his reply was that most of the flat owners dont live anywhere near the flats, with 3 living in england, another in inverness and the rest spread over scotland, he then added oh well put me in jail for not having an agm!
He did say that when he bought his first flat it was from the woman who was running the association and he just adopted the position as nobody else wanted it.

Check your lease first.

Then write to him and ask on what legal basis the residents' association is constituted and from where does it derive its mandate to take these decisions.

As he has now mentioned 'small claims court', I would do this anyway regardless. The letter should be as short as possible, in order not to allow him to answer other points instead.

moneyistooshorttomention

Seconded - re checking the lease generally - and those insurance arrangements.

Then go for it....

He'll probably (certainly) throw another fit - but, in worst case analysis that he did take you to small claims court (which I doubt actually....) then provide yourself with the evidence that you personally are trying to do things all openly/fairly/etc/etc.

On a worst case analysis - ie he did go for small claims court - then just how much money could it cost anyway IF he did that and IF he won.

I reckon he's most probably bluffing...you've rattled his cage obviously..

G_M

Beavishep wrote: »

I have just managed to get him on the phone, surprisingly when i questioned his methods he spat the dummy and said that i could take the job on if i wasnt happy, he also said that if we dont pay then he will take us to the small claims court .

This was what I meant about rocking the boat.

I'm not saying you should pay - just that you need to consider all the angles, and one angle is that some sort of management may be better than no management at all.

Comments about checking the lease: this would certainly apply in England, but I understand Scotland does blocks of flats differently. No leases, but I'm not clear what legal mechanism replaces them.

I also believe it's normal (common?) to have a 'Factor' to manage blocks in Scotland, though I don't understand the legal set up. Perhaps he is the building Factor?

Have you anything from the legal packs when you bought the property? Surely this sort of thing should have been explained to you - assuming you used a solicitor.....? May be time to get legal advice.

Be that as it may, I doubt any Small Claims Court Action against you would work
a) I don't think they have them; it would be a sheriff's court?
b) the RA is clearly an ad hoc organisation (I use the word loosely as there seems no organisation) so I doubt it has any power to impose charges for anything, let alone carpets.

I would be contacting all flat owners. If the flats are tenanted, find the owners. Knock on doors and ask. Use the Land Rgistry. Write letters. Google addresses Use a bit of initiative and find the other people.

Meanwhile don't pay. Make him make the next move..... if he does.

Beavishep

G_M wrote: »

This was what I meant about rocking the boat.

I'm not saying you should pay - just that you need to consider all the angles, and one angle is that some sort of management may be better than no management at all.

Comments about checking the lease: this would certainly apply in England, but I understand Scotland does blocks of flats differently. No leases, but I'm not clear what legal mechanism replaces them.

I also believe it's normal (common?) to have a 'Factor' to manage blocks in Scotland, though I don't understand the legal set up. Perhaps he is the building Factor?

Have you anything from the legal packs when you bought the property? Surely this sort of thing should have been explained to you - assuming you used a solicitor.....? May be time to get legal advice.

Be that as it may, I doubt any Small Claims Court Action against you would work
a) I don't think they have them; it would be a sheriff's court?
b) the RA is clearly an ad hoc organisation (I use the word loosely as there seems no organisation) so I doubt it has any power to impose charges for anything, let alone carpets.

I would be contacting all flat owners. If the flats are tenanted, find the owners. Knock on doors and ask. Use the Land Rgistry. Write letters. Google addresses Use a bit of initiative and find the other people.

Meanwhile don't pay. Make him make the next move..... if he does.

Yes im not quite understanding checking the lease as we bought the flat, as in we own it outright.
You are right that some management is better than none, you mention building factor, that is what he said tonight, he bought his flat from a woman that was carrying out the factoring and he adopted it from her.
He said something about it being in the deeds to the building, but no when we bought it there was no mention of it from the solicitor, first we heard was a letter from him a few months after we completed the purchase, i still have to look at the deeds to see whats in them.
I suggested to him that it may be a better idea to increase everybodys monthly maintenance fee to cover any future work, that way the voting system hes using would then decide how to spend money already saved, rather than his current system of him deciding to have work done then tell us we have to pay for it! He did agree to this suggestion and said he would put it forward in his yearly letter to everybody.
Its the fact that work has already started a whole week before his original vote deadline that is grating a bit, and also being told we will be paying for this basically because he says so!!